Transcript: Episode #213: Forging Solidarity Across Conflict
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Host 0:14
Thank you for joining us for the next hour to in this episode of Inside Myanmar podcast. In an age of nearly limitless content, we appreciate that you're choosing to take valuable time out of your day. To learn more about what is happening in Myanmar, it's vital for the story to be heard by people around the world. And that starts right now with you.
Host 1:42
and welcome to this episode of insight Myanmar podcast, we have two speakers on that are both from action Corp. We're going to learn a little bit more about their organization and what they what they've done historically, as well as how they've been involved recently with Myanmar. So our guests today are Isaac oven friends and Jay justice, like to welcome both of them for joining this platform. So Isaac and Jay, thanks so much for coming on, and sharing your voices and some of the activities that you're doing.
Isaac Evans-Frantz 2:12
Thanks so much for having us.
Jade 2:14
Thank you for having us.
Host 2:15
So let's start with Isaac, Isaac, if you can tell us your role at action Corp. As well as before we get into Myanmar, if you can just give us a bit of history in terms of what your organization is, what your mission is, and what some of your past activities have been.
Isaac Evans-Frantz 2:32
So action Corp is a humanitarian advocacy organization that grew out of the NGO Oxfam America, we are independent from Oxfam. Our mission is to champion justice and solidarity with people facing disasters around the world, climate disasters, violent conflict, we campaign for US policy to save lives around the world. We do this by bringing together people from all different walks of life around the United States to advocate for policies to save lives, and that's with their member mostly with people, members of Congress. We played a major role in the passage of the Yemen War Powers resolution to stop illegal US participation in the war in Yemen. And we continue to lead a national coalition coalition to address the humanitarian crisis in Yemen, which the United States continues to enable. We organize the Global Day of Action world says no to war on Yemen in 2021, with which became the largest anti war mobilization since 2003, we convened over 100 different organizations and advocating for the release of emergency financial resources from the International Monetary Fund called Special Drawing Rights, which in 2021, was they made the largest release in the history of the institution of those financial resources that were really important for low income and middle income countries. And we continue to advocate for another such release. We have also been involved with advocacy for ethnic people in Burma in solidarity with the groups that are doing that work from the United States. And that that work, we started long before the coup and played a role with the passage of the Burma act in late last year and are currently advocating for passage of the Senate Resolution 20, which condemns the Burma coup and pressure the Biden administration to enact enact sanctions on the Myanmar military. So that's a little bit about what we've been up to and glad to answer more questions or pass it over to Jade.
Host 4:40
Yeah. So to follow up on that, you know, there's a lot of problems in the world, say the understatement of the year and many different injustices and things that one can be involved with. So from an organization like yours, how do you determine which projects you're going to focus on which Countries are going to be area of concern. And with that in mind how and when, as well did Burma start to become on your radar as something that you really wanted to devote some of your resources as an organization to understanding and supporting?
Isaac Evans-Frantz 5:15
Well, it comes down to where we see an opportunity to make a difference where we see there's a problem and the scale of the problem facing humanity. And then well, what's our connection? And where where can we speak up and help move policy? We became involved with the crisis in Myanmar, that when we heard about the Rohingya people, the genocide, we were one of our our founding board members was in Indiana, where there's a community that folks who are, were really concerned about the crisis and doing humanitarian solidarity, work, fundraising, that sort of thing. And we saw, okay, well, let's, we connected with folks who are working on US policy. So that's, it's been, as we've learned about different crises. Currently, we're organizing an event about the crisis in Sudan, because that's, that's going on right now. And we see a need for discussion for education. But the work and having to Yemen was because the larger the home of the largest humanitarian crisis on the planet is in Yemen. And so just the sheer scale, and the role of the United States. And similarly with with Burma there, the United States, could be playing a role that was much stronger in stopping the persecution of ethnic peoples in Burma and helping support the democracy movement in the country.
Host 6:41
Right. And so you reference this background of, of being involved in Yemen, particularly, and in Sudan, as well as other conflicts in other countries. And so I'd be interested to ask you, especially from someone like myself, that really hasn't been looking so much at other crises, let alone and falls with, I'm really just focused on on this, because it's a country I spent so much time in and have so many connections to, but as someone who's been involved with these other crises in other parts of the world have, have you seen different similarities or commonalities running through them or you're able, from your experience with a previous one, you're able to apply it with something that you're, you're now seeing in Burma that maybe maybe gives you a bit of perspective or shortcut into it?
Isaac Evans-Frantz 7:23
Yes, I think we have, we have certainly learned from these campaigns and able to apply some of some of that knowledge. You know, one of those one of those things, and Jade could talk more about this, but there's just the importance of relationships. So sometimes it's, it's like our relationship that we built with particular Senate offices, around the Yemen solidarity work, we were able to go back to those offices and say we'd like to talk to you about another issue that's important to us. Genocide and persecution in Myanmar. And, you know, we had a, we had already had that path to the those staff members in those Senate offices. So that's an example of how, you know, these. It's these relationships are so filled with congressional offices. And I think also an understanding of the just the power of grassroots the power of everyday people around this country, in the United States. And also seeing this in other countries as well. We've been super inspired by the the movement for democracy and human rights in Myanmar. And like the idea that everybody for where they, wherever they are, can speak up and can make a difference. And these are what, regardless of what the issue is.
Host 8:41
Great. So let's go over to Jade, and if you could tell us a bit about your background about when the coup first happened and your immediate response both personally as well as what you started to do. And then how you became involved in action Corp and what you've been doing there.
Jade 8:58
Absolutely. So I actually grew up as a kitchen, American. You know, both my parents are kitchen from Burma. And growing up in the United States, I was always made aware of the issues that were happening over there, back at home. And I couldn't help but to feel that I had some sort of duty or some sense of responsibility towards the people back in my home country, you know, who were really just going under terrible poverty. And on top of that, as we saw later, you know, the 2021 coup. So I'm what I was already doing prior to the coup, I was getting involved myself like into some Burma advocacy work, which was through stand I got a little foothold into that. And that was like my foot in the door kind of entryway. And once I got involved with Stan, the student led movement to NGOs at a mass atrocities. I served as the Burma committee co leader for about two years and I believe in my second year, um, that was when I really started venturing even further out, because I wanted to get even more involved, you know, and get even more into the grassroots. And that's when I got connected with action corps through Stand and it was as if like one door led to another. And I, you know, just made my way there, got to connect with Isaac and all these other friends that were part of action Corp, and really saw the powerful actions that they were all taking together and just yeah, all the passion that they were really putting in together community, you know, and going back to what Isaac was saying about the power of relationships, I really saw the power of connection and relationships, especially within the actual core community itself, and how they were really just, you know, I guess harnessing that, so that we could all continue moving forward to, you know, make these stronger connections, again, with like, you know, House and Senate offices, to continue showing also solidarity amongst our own peoples, myself included, you know, being an ethnic kitchen person be connected with someone else who's ethically Yemeni herself, like, you know, Auntie Samaya, who is within the action Corps, I felt like these relationships was were really powerful in a sense of solidarity, so that we could further advocate for one another's causes and see the larger picture in the world of what we were really advocating for, which is, you know, just people who are in need all over the world.
Host 11:16
Right, and it's quite some time this resistance movement is continued, both in the country and out of the country. And we we've seen a real kind of awakening of the many members of the younger generation in Myanmar, I've had so many countless interviews where there were so many people that were in that were caught up in different parts of the transition there and didn't have his political consciousness. And so I'm wondering what you found of the range of responses of the younger members of the diaspora you've seen in how in creating a sense of political consciousness or awakening or, or maybe not so much, or maybe happening in different qualities, but what have you seen among other kind of members of the youth diaspora Myanmar around the world?
Jade 11:58
Right, I love that you asked this question, because it's actually so important. I really do wish, personally that a lot more young people like myself in the diaspora, we get more involved, it seems as if we're all really on put on a lot of different scales, you know, the situation. Um, if I were to say, for example, for myself, I really do find a lot of privilege, which is why white privilege in my own standing, which is why I knowing this, I really do want to make use of this privilege, so that I could further help people on the ground. And I would say, not everyone is fortunate enough to be in the same position as I am, which is the sad reality. Some people are out here, you know, living paycheck to paycheck, probably, some people have come as refugees, which is different from my situation, my circumstances that my parents came as immigrants, economic immigrants, you could say, whereas some other friends of mine, within the refugee community, they didn't come that way, you know, they came, literally to flee war and on the country in the ground. So you have different starting points, I would say like when it comes to being a jasper member in the United States, or wherever else around the world, I would also say that if I do, like, you know, refrain from talking too much about the 2021 coup, it's just because it's all been a blur in my mind, to be honest, I just remember, this is again, where I have so much privilege and being able to sit behind a laptop, you know, and type away and just do whatever work I need to do, like mentally to help out as much as I can with people on the ground. But, yeah, it's, it's been a lot of mental work, I would say, when addressing these kind of issues. And even with reaching out to other diaspora members, it's all like, pretty much online, I would say, um, so having like fast fingers to type away, or just, you know, even being able to communicate fast with other people and organize people in a fast fashion. It's all been a lot of mental work. So yeah, I just remember anything from the coup was that we really had to be in this zone. And having all these other colleagues help along with that was super important. And I would say, a lot of people with this political consciousness, what they really need is just to even further go into their themselves, like really identify who they are. I think I'm really fortunate to say that I grew up having a strong sense of identity, cultural identity. But a lot of that may not be the case for a lot of other kids that come from, you know, a similar background as me. So I think that what's happening right now, what that we see with a lot of desperate kids is that we're all struggling with a sense of cultural identity, whether it's, you know, our own traditional identity or whether it's with like the home country that we go into and adapt into, like I remember growing up feeling as if I was I was never American enough or I was never kitchen enough? And what does it even mean to be kitchen? Right? Or what does it even mean to be American? What does it mean to be Burmese truly, it's tough for a lot of kids to identify and pick and choose or even, like, feel weird being the the in between, you know, like, as if they're, they're not either or. So I think what's really needed in order to address this issue is also just to come together, once again, like we do already in organizing, and bring people together so that they can have that stronger sense of identity. And once we have collective identity, I truly believe that collective action can be taken, looking
Host 15:39
at this issue as kind of the the inner outer perspective of, and I've referenced this kind of Burma bubble, that those that that are, that are in the movement, whether they're in the country or outside of it, in some form, are very committed and very connected. But, you know, there's also been this concern and one of the podcasts we had some time ago with Nederman, sway who is a one of the main fundraisers for the N ug in Los Angeles. And she kind of spoke aloud with a problem that many people have known about, but it hasn't really been in a public forum. And it resonated with a lot of members, the diaspora what she said it, which was this concern that, that many of the fundraising and advocacy events that are happening are really being led by and led for Burmese. And there's there's not so much of there's not as much of an engagement from local people in terms of where What country is taking place, in this case, the United States, as as it is those diaspora communities. And so a real effort of how do we involve? How do we make this not a kitchen struggle or a chin struggle or rent struggle, etc, but a Burmese struggle and then not even a Burmese struggle? But how do we make this a human issue of, you know, human rights and democracy and all these universal values that that we hold, dear. And that should concern anyone living on this earth? How do we make that bridge and we've explored a little bit of that in our platform we had, we've had podcasts contrasting and exploring what's happening in Ukraine, what's happening in Iran, and they've had ideas about being able to bring together activists from those countries, Hong Kong as well, that might be able to share tactics and strategies, and as well as just boosting morale and talking about, you know, just the reminding, reminding themselves of why they're doing what they're doing. And this thought was triggered by what both of you said what Jade said about this, on a personal level, this connection you're making with someone from Yemen, who is coming from a very different background, and probably facing a very different challenge, but also holding those same ideals and what Isaac was mentioned about the past work of action Corp. And so I think this question would address both of you in different ways, whether it's more the more personal connections that can be formed and forged by bringing people together from those different movements, or whether it's something whether it's looking more bird's eye perspective of, of the shape of these conflicts, and the activism that emerges from them. That concern
Jade 18:05
or at that point that you really pointed out is super important, because I myself have also like notices as well. And the answer to that I feel like would be to, again, like, you know, we these connections that we have with other members from the or just other people, other ethnic groups, I think it's good to tag along to those issues, and not just tag along but like, show the intersections or show the parallels that exist and show how, although, you know, they come from different parts of the world, people wherever they are, can be facing similar issues. And, and really just Yeah, showboat intersections exist. Because at the end of the day, we all live in one planet, we all live in one world, much of the problems that may be existing in say, Burma, are pretty, you know, similar to any problem that can exist elsewhere around the world, whether it's through, you know, systemic injustice, or even police brutality, or racism, you know, all of these issues can definitely be pinpointed out and the intersections can be drawn. And I feel like doing those kind of intersections and joining those kind of intersections, as well, as, you know, putting these solidarity movements together, I think that's what's really key. And I remember having like, a thought about this for such a long time to have some sort of solidarity campaign, and it's difficult, as amazing as an idea it is, I found that it's difficult to do, unless you really have all hands on board. And you really have to, you know, go through the nitty gritty of like, figuring out what schedules other people are going through, or what kind of campaigns they have in mind. It's all about kind of bringing everything together like an orchestra, you know, it's hard to go out it as if you're on this as a three or this one player, you know, in a game. You really have to get, get all these links together, you know, get everyone's hand hands like hell together, truly and just figure out something, brainstorm together, have talks together, it takes time, it takes effort. It's definitely not an overnight thing. So yeah, it's something that I hope to see in the near future, like really form materialistically, if that makes sense. And yeah, just like be able to have pictures for it or not just pictures, but beyond that have real actual, you know, connections to show for it.
Isaac Evans-Frantz 20:35
I want to add in that I have seen some amazing organizing happening across communities in the San Francisco Bay Area in California, where for Human Rights Day on December 10, for the last two years, folks have come together across diaspora communities for Filipinos, many many's from other groups as well, who have come together and called out the US is foreign policy that has really supported dictatorships supported genocide. And it's been amazingly powerful just to see the energy when groups do come together like that. And that the march that didn't have so many 1000s of it wasn't 1000s of people, it was hundreds, if anything, and they got coverage and mainstream media, they had, there was an energy and a synergy with with groups coming together and learning that happens. So any opportunity that we can find to support one another's causes and struggles is so important. I think we have a common, there's a commonality here, which is when we look at US foreign policy. That's it really prioritizes geopolitical domination control. And you know, after that is an interest in commercial relations. And then finally, if it makes the list at all, it's democracy and human rights. So so it's important for those of us who care about democracy and human rights, to call this out, and to see how our struggles are connected, and to help make this higher on the list. And, you know, it's amazing what the coalition in the United States for Myanmar, the US Advocacy Coalition, achieved last year with the December 2022 passage of the Burma Act and the National Defense Authorization Act. I mean, the fact that is, is that this was arguably arguably the the most significant, most robust action that the US Congress has taken on Myanmar and 1519 years. That was the result of grassroots organizing. It was coalition's that formed across all 50 states in the United States, the March of 1000s, of people who gathered in Washington for the sake of Myanmar March and August of 2021. And the advocacy work that came out of that the dozens and dozens of meetings with US Senate offices, covering nearly every state, the relationships that were built with members of the House Foreign Affairs Committee. And, you know, I remember seeing pictures where Jade was it was meeting with, you know, having a happy hour with these high high profile US senators. And that sort of movement building was incredible to watch. And, you know, it was it was awesome to see the involvement of religious institutions as well, you know, my understanding is that there are about 300,000 people of Myanmar descent living in the United States, and the vast majority are Christian and belong to denominations that have influence in Congress. And that ability to help move us Senate offices was key in getting this legislation through a Congress and signed into law by the President. And now what we're trying to do is just get that what the Biden what Biden has pledged and what he's spoken about. We're just trying to get that accomplished, and make sure that the actions match the words.
Host 24:05
Right. And this goes along with something, Isaac that you wrote, as, as notes preparing for this interview, I want to read these words back, and maybe you can unpack them and share a bit how they relate to what you just said, you describe the work of action Corp as we punch above our weight by building coalitions. So can you describe in the context of what you're sharing now and what way that phrase animates your work?
Isaac Evans-Frantz 24:33
Sure. So action Corps is we're volunteers and about 30 states and we have slightly over one full time staff member. So we what we have found is that when we bring people together from different states from different organizations, that's where we find power because everybody has something to bring to the table. And I'm remembering a meeting that we had with the staff for Senator Risch, who is the senior Republican member of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee. And we there were a couple people on the call from Idaho, who's the state that he represents in Congress. And then there are also a couple of folks who are from ethnic groups in Burma. And the staff member says, as some questions, some technical question or some sort of pushback, and that the person who is one of the people whose family's from Burma said, you know, I know very little about legislation, but I do know a lot about suffering. And that was so powerful to have his voice part of that conversation. And we had a had a meeting with Senator Mitch McConnell staff where we brought together folks from Jewish Christian, Kentucky, Myanmar does diaspore groups to have this meeting, and it was that coalition, the diverse perspectives that were in the room that really helped to make it make our message. Really powerful. And so that's, that's why we need everybody. And we need all of the different groups that can come together to speak up on this issue.
Host 26:18
So staying on the topic of message that gets to the question of narrative, and narrative is so important narrative really was what drives things forward. So you can have facts and news and analysis and commentary and all those things. But they, they don't really move the needle unless they're tied together and bound by dynamic storytelling, because at the end of the day, everyone loves a story and what you just shared about the phrase of the person saying, I don't know, legislation, but I know suffering. That's a story that storytelling, you know, that's something that breaks through and emerges. And I think one of the challenges that has also been faced with specifically in Burma, is what is the narrative because, you know, the the one big blue roadblock to it is that for years, it did have a consistent narrative. You know, it was a bit reductionist, and it ignored a lot of what was really happening. But the narrative was centered around the perceived nobility of Aung San su chi, and then, as the ring of crisis develop, and there was her role in it, and that fell through and there was a sense of people felt betrayed and confused by what happened. And then there was this vacuum of if that's not the narrative, what is it and in some ways, the narrative still became that it still became, you know, Myanmar was reduced to Aung San su G's role in the Rohingya crisis. And that really, really harmed especially after the coup going through today, what kinds of messages engagements we can have with those with that narrative. And I've heard another concern that in terms of the diaspora communities, wanting to bring them together under a bigger tent, rather than having the different ethnic groups advocating and lobbying for their personal interests, understandably, as a group who has been persecuted for so long, but something that is, is a wider coalition of of many different groups and voices coming together. And so I guess this question, and we can ask, Jade, this, what challenges do you see with the narrative of trying to bring engagement and interest in Myanmar, to wider local engagement across this country, at least people to want to understand and the care
Jade 28:31
sometimes I've seen, or that there really is, I would say, a misunderstanding of the real issues of what's going on at hand on the ground, like you said, with the, you know, just the framing of like, the entire narrative of the issues that are going on? Let's start with that. I think the real issue, just to be clear, is that it's really been the persecution of ethnic minorities for decades. And it's, it's just been that from the start, and it continues to be that today. And any other narrative that counters that is, or any other narrative that kind of skews that, or it doesn't match along with those lines, I think it's just, it's not right. It's just a very inaccurate, it's misleading. And I would say, in order to really be able to, you know, I guess counter this or fix this narrative is just allow people to understand that, um, these people have been suffering for a long time. And what's really needed is just help. And I think the problem is, people don't seem to care enough, because it doesn't seem relevant to their day to day issues, or maybe it seems just too far away. When in reality, you have to point out that like Isaac also mentioned we have 300,000 You know, diaspora members here in this country alone. Let's make it real. You know, let's make it personal. Let's make it as if These are our neighbors, that we have relatives living here on the ground in the country, and that they're not too far they're not actually like, across the world as we imagined it to be, or they're not as far as we think they are. A lot of people just are yearning for this freedom and democracy that the United States does have all, you know, as, as much as we do have our own issues here. But there's just a lot of clearing of the mind that we are not clearing of the mind. But just like, we just need a lot more unity around this issue. And I think, because Burma is also so divided, it's hard to get this sense of unity. And it's hard to get this sense of like, a single narrative that really boils down to the truth. It's not just about one lady. It's not just about the Rohingya, but it's really about everyone, all these ethnic minorities, including the Rohingya that have been persecuted under the Myanmar military, because of this, this power vacuum that, you know, kind of came into place due to colonialism, you know, it dates back to that. So a lot of the prevalent problem was an issue that we're seeing today stem back from a long history of just persecution. And also, in addition to that, it's like not having enough education. Because there's because you have generations of people being uneducated, you have a whole group of people that are stuck in a certain mindset, that cannot allow them to move forward. So I would say education is completely key, one of the key things to allow people to get out of this. And, you know, with education, we see better narratives. So I would say, that's, that's where the power of raising awareness comes in. And that's where the power of grassroots comes in what Isaac is doing what all of our other friends in action Corp and US ACM and all these other coalition groups are doing, I think that's, that's why we say we see a lot of power in these groups.
Host 32:03
Right. And I want to also refer back to another thing that Nando Armand sway said in our conversation, where she talked about Burmese cultural patterns, and she referenced how there's a Burmese cultural tendency to not want to show your pain and to want to go to work smiling, and then come home and cry. And that that Burmese cultural tendency has been very counterproductive in terms of in an American context of wanting to, to be vulnerable and open up and reveal the depths of the pain and trauma that are occurring. And it's only by doing that, that that others who aren't attuned are aware of what's happening can come in that's, I mean, that's one of the main purposes of the podcast platform, we have aside from the, the more content interviews we have, but to be able to speak to a variety of people and really have that platform of sharing and opening and, and having a greater human insight into what what things actually feel like. And, and I know this is a this could be a generalized thing to say, and there are different different ethnic communities in different generations. And it depends on how long one has been in one culture versus another. But to what degree would you referring back to Nendaz words of this kind of Burmese cultural characteristic of being a bit more modest in in revealing one's difficulties? To what degree do you think this has impacted the engagement and awareness of to outside communities about what's really happening?
Jade 33:33
Um, I think it does play a role to some degree. Because, again, culture is all inside the mind, right. And with the mind, you carry this mindset with you anywhere you go, no matter where you are. So even in the United States, I would say, some families, they may, like, play into that mindset by just carrying on with their daily lives, you know, just working as if the suffering is all on their own. And perhaps this is the reason why it's hard to get any organizing done, in a sense, because everyone, at least immigrants, you know, are just going by day to day living their immigrant lives, focusing on putting food on the table, you know, basic necessities like that. Getting kids through school, just making enough money to survive, because what I've noticed also, even in my own parents, is that sometimes they're destined to be this survival mentality that adults in the older generation carry, simply because that's the mentality that they came in with to America, you know, having to start over again, from scratch, not having any connections. And even with myself growing up in United States, I would say I had quite a unique experience where I would say I didn't feel American enough because we were in this really sheltered community a bubble like On every Sunday, it would be like going to our Burmese church. And it's still to this day, I still attend, you know, Burmese churches. And I'm surrounded very much by the Burmese committee, because that's how I was raised. And it's really weird once you step out of that bubble, because that's all you know. But for a lot of the older generation, they tend to be in these bubbles, because that's their comfort, that's their safety. That's their, that's their, you know, that's just their network, like where they can just bounce back on anytime. And even within these networks, though, it seems as if they're all just there for one another like to be there in physical presence, but not so much mentally or psychologically, if that makes sense. Because I don't think they were ever taught that way. There are there is definitely a huge lack of mental health awareness inside the country. So you can't ever expect anyone who comes from Burma to, you know, suddenly open up in American terms, right, or just suddenly become American overnight. I would say a lot of people who would do come from Burma and have lived a lot of their years over there come with already a fixed mindset, that's really hard to undo unless they're really open for it. And it's hard, because I don't think it really is an individual basis. But from what I've observed, a lot of people tend not to come with an open mind as much just because they feel that their age limits them from, you know, continuing to learn more or grow more, where I would really disagree. But, you know, again, it's all about perception and about the mindset, which goes back to the culture that we carry.
Host 36:32
I guess that also highlights the real critical role that this younger generation and diaspora can be playing and knowing the culture and knowing the suffering and also knowing the culture they've adapted to, and the ways of expression and medium and being able to try to be that bridge and educator of that. Because really, these these voices have to get out in a bigger way there have to hit there, to bring this engagement, there has to be some process of, of constructing this narrative or having these voices come and educating people on not just the facts, but again, going back to that dynamic storytelling in some form. And storytelling doesn't mean you tell a formal story from start to finish. And go back to what Isaac said, saying that that's a beautiful quote of we don't know, legislation, but we know suffering, just those are things that can turn a lightbulb on. So I wonder how how those voices can be more harnessed, and, and, and shared to be able to draw people in.
Isaac Evans-Frantz 37:34
You know, I'll chime in here that I have been in meetings with US senators, who really didn't seem particularly interested in hearing about the crisis that we were talking about, you know, who even senior US senators who when we mentioned Burma, they said, you know, or the Burma act, they said, Well, you know, there are over 200 countries, I can't worry about all of them, kind of feeling. But I have seen that when people who are from the country in question speak. There's a moral authority and credibility that nobody else in that room has. And I've, I've seen US senators, take the business ask for the business cards of people from a country that we were talking about. And that's, you know, that's unusual for a US senator to ask, Oh, I'd like to build a follow up who, who bumped into colleagues of ours in Washington and said, you know, someone from Yemen, when we're talking about Yemen came to my office, and they were they were moved by the story. So you know, I would, I would hope that people who are listening to this would never underestimate the power of your story, the power of your voice, in potentially moving somebody in a very powerful role. And, you know, despite the challenges that you and Jade have have mentioned, in organizing and storytelling, the fact is that people from Burma and the children of people from Burma played a major role in moving legislation through the US Congress, when the people in Congress were paralyzed. They they couldn't move they were your personal and partisan conflicts, were preventing any movement on this Burma legislation. And after over a dozen years, we got the most the strongest legislation that's come out of Congress and all that time, at a very, at a time when it's very partisan with a whole lot of division. But it was activists, it was advocacy, folks like Jade who organize people across the country to move this legislation. So to me that's incredibly inspiring and incredibly important for us to celebrate those successes along the way. I can imagine you know, if you're in if you're experiencing the persecution you're feeling experiencing the crisis or your family is it might be hard to think about celebrating at this time. Yeah, but it is important for us to acknowledge the really, really important work that people from Burma and their children have done in this country in just recent months and moving legislation. And, you know, it's I think it's important for us to not stop, because obviously, there's a whole lot more needed. And we need the Biden administration to use its leverage for a democratic governance and return to that and ending the violent military coup. And the the Biden administration has leveraged it could be using its it said, the Biden has said the right things, we just need to see the Biden administration actually enact those targeted sanctions on the Myanmar military, we need to make sure that the United States stops selling the aviation fuel that's being used by the Myanmar, the hunter, we need to make sure that the United States is having integrity here and not being complicit in the crimes that are being committed. The United States has incredible amount of power. And that's why we're organizing to increase. It's the number of senators who are on Senate Resolution 20, condemning the coup and calling for the release of people who have been detained and returned to democratic governance. That's why people anywhere in the United States could can be asking their senators to join this resolution. It's a bipartisan resolution. And there are several Democrats on there, we'd like to see more Republicans. So we're focused on some key offices. But folks in any country here, you know, especially in the UK, in the in Europe, can be advocating for in their own governments for for laws that are in solidarity with the the democratic movements and the people who are living in Burma.
Host 41:52
You reference just the power of grassroots local activism and lobbying in an organization, how much that's done to get where we are now in terms of this conflict, as well as others. And looking ahead, what could be done in the US and other countries that could continue to build and follow up and really empower those people listening those people everywhere that might feel they're just one person and can't do much in the conflict around the world. But you're saying that they can, you're saying that there's a track record of that success? And so, and you've described some of those things, and some of those ways they can do was there? Is there anywhere else you wanted to expand on that or to flesh out where and how people can be involved and do something that could move the needle a little bit? Sure.
Isaac Evans-Frantz 42:38
Well, first of all, people in the United States can visit action corp.org/burma, which and take action, they're to reach out to their member of the United States Senate, about legislation that's it's in the Senate. That's action corp.org And Corp is spelled co RP s. So we have an action opportunity, there were a form that people can fill out to send a letter. And folks, anybody anywhere in the world can visit our website and support our organization, either financially or taking an action with that campaign. That's, that's one thing that people can do. People can also get the talking in their religious communities, in their community, in their schools and their workplaces, getting people to be aware of the crisis and taking action and meeting with their members of Congress. If there's opportunity, there are opportunities for organizing are endless. And I've been I've been I've loved seeing some of Jade's work, the creativity, the The Tick Tock videos, the Instagram post, you know, the way that people have been able to use creativity and connection to build awareness about the crisis that's, that's going on.
Host 43:55
Thanks for that. And for Jade, what, what would you like to see what's helpful from the international community not in terms of large scale organizations or governments, but just in terms of foreign allies in terms of people that that feel a sense of sorrow and, and a wish for engagement in what's happening with Myanmar with the democracy movement, and are not exactly sure the best way they can be involved on on just a human to human level?
Jade 44:25
Well, I would say, since a lot of people are on social media these days, social media is a great tool to raise awareness about what's happening in Burma. A simple share, you know, to your story of a post from let's say, action Corp or wherever else, like even my own Instagram, hatching put shade, or I think stream what, JJ? Yeah, I'm just just sharing any posts you see about Burma really, um, to your stories, that helps a lot. And in addition to that, resharing posts helps a lot too. And then if you want to climb up the ladder, there's a Was his letter of action where after you do those kind of little actions on social media, you can also go as far as signing petitions online. And again, like this is all from the comfort of your home, you don't have to go anywhere, you just go online, you can see, you can even do a simple Google search of all these. And then see what kind of Burma organizations exist. I'm typing in, you know, Burma organizations. From the top of my head, I can say that there's ICR international campaign for Rohingya. There's GM forum D, global movement for more democracy. There's us action Corp. There's also us ACM available on Facebook, a bunch of different organizations, you can see that will pop up that have lots of actions for you to take in terms of petitions, and beyond petitions, you if you want to really take a step up, you can join in the meetings that Isaac and I are organizing, with Senate and House offices to really push for legislation, that will have a bigger impact, globally. So that's what I would recommend for anyone who wants to, you know, just get their feet wet in the advocacy space, or just take a simple action and start to, you know, engage with these issues. I would also say in addition to that, just get to know people, you know, if you have any neighbors around you, that happens to be from the member community. They're everywhere, they're scattered all around. I mean, Isaac even mentioned how we have an action corps member from, I believe, was in the NRA. There's a lot of chin, people that live in Indiana, there's also a huge population of people who live in the DC metropolitan area, we even have a church that I go to, you know, you're always welcome to stop by and anyone who's interested, and getting to know the community, I feel like these are honestly the that is the most powerful way to get to know people, like when you just talk with them in conversation, you learn so much more by being in person with someone when you would ever like online, just by you know, seeing how the mannerisms are seeing just getting a vibe of the people, you know, and, and just even sharing foods together in this kind of church settings, like it helps a lot to just on a human to human level, get to know them and get to know their stories so that you really understand where they're coming from, why they act the way they do. Why? Why all the suffering has even happened in the first place. So yeah, that's what I recommend.
Host 47:24
Yeah, I think that's great. And I think it's really just, it just really takes one kind of spark, to to make someone see why this is something they should care about. And again, that I just keep saying it, it goes back to this storytelling and storytelling can be long form. Or it could be just a couple of words that that create that spark. And I guess it would be interesting to check in with Isaac. And if there was a moment that create that you can remember that created that spark for you, or what led you to want to be involved in care about this issue with someone who I don't believe has really spent a lot of time in Myanmar per se. I've
Isaac Evans-Frantz 48:01
actually never been to Myanmar. But when I was a child, somebody came to my class and spoke about surviving the Holocaust. And he had been in a Nazi death camp, he showed us the number on his arm, and he told us horrific stories. And I think I kind of promised myself after that, that if I were ever in a position where I knew about some genocide that were happening, or some catastrophe like that was, was harming my fellow human beings that was going on, I would you know that I would do everything that I could to stop that. And, you know, once you find out about this person, the persecution of ethnic peoples in Burma or the the violence that's happening against the collective communal violence that's happening, you can't unknow that. Yeah. And so, you know, my, I think, of course, we'd love for listeners to visit action corp.org and take action for our Burma work and action corp.org/burma We welcome support. But the most important message that I would want people to hear is that you for especially for the folks who are listening from who are in Burma, or whose families are in Burma is that you're not alone. You're not forgotten, that we are going to keep fighting in solidarity with you for as long as we are able or and as long as there's a need. So that's, that's my message is that you're not alone.
Host 49:39
Thank you. Yeah, certainly. And I echo that as well. I echo that as is also through the nonprofit that are Burma that we run, which has a number of humanitarian projects on the ground, as well as this media podcast platform. The hundreds of guests that we have on the 10s of 1000s of listeners that have tuned in taking their time to want to learn and want to hear and I know it can certainly Eat feel very alone in terms of the international community's response and the burden that is placed on the shoulders of those few people that are that are still striving for these noble goals and resisting the military. And yet, that's also a persistent message that we hope these kinds of conversations can bring people together as, as guests and speakers and listeners, that that there is this community who cares. And that is showing up, even though it's sometimes not as visible as we all would like it to be?
Jade 50:31
Very much. So. Just want to say thanks so much for taking the time to talk with us and shed light on Burma issues. Because, again, this is so needed, like you said, it's not given enough international attention, or in the media, and specifically. So yeah, I'm just really grateful for this time that we had. I hope that we all can use this time to continue thinking about ways to help Burma and the people on the ground. And for anyone who's listening also just to feel encouraged that there are people out here who are trying to make a difference and that you can too, and no one is ever alone, like our power really does come from coming together. And yeah, just being in solidarity.
Host 51:28
Thank you for taking the time to listen to this episode. As regular listeners are aware, we often remind our audience about our nonprofit mission better Burma at the end of the show. Truth be told fundraising is hard work. And I can personally attest to the fact that it's really no fun to keep asking for contributions. Yet the situation on the ground now in Myanmar is so distressing, that we continue to do so on behalf of the Burmese people. What is most helpful at this time are recurring donations, which help alleviate both the stress and time involved in fundraising. If you were able to pledge a certain amount per month, our team can plan around having at least a consistent minimum amount to work within each month. If you would like to join in our mission to support those in Myanmar who are being impacted by the military coup, we welcome your contribution in a form currency or transfer method. Your donation will go on to support a wide range of humanitarian and media missions, aiding those local communities who need it most. Donations are directed to such causes as the Civil Disobedience movement CDM families of deceased victims, internally displaced person IDP camps, food for impoverished communities, military defection campaigns, undercover journalists, refugee camps, monasteries and nunneries education initiatives, the purchasing of protective equipment and medical supplies COVID relief and more. We also make sure that our donation Fund supports a diverse range of religious and ethnic groups across the country. We invite you to visit our website to learn more about past projects as well as upcoming needs. You can give a general donation or earmark your contribution to a specific activity or project you would like to support, perhaps even something you heard about in this very episode. All of this humanitarian work is carried out by our nonprofit mission that or Burma. Any donation you give on our insight Myanmar website is directed towards this fun. Alternatively, you can also visit the better Burma website better burma.org and donate directly there. In either case, your donation goes to the same cause and both websites accept credit card. You can also give via PayPal by going to paypal.me/better Burma. Additionally, we can take donations through Patreon Venmo GoFundMe and Cash App. Simply search better Burma on each platform and you'll find our account. You can also visit either website for specific links to these respective accounts or email us at info@betterburma.org. That's better Burma. One word, spelled b e t t e r b u r m a.org. If you'd like to give it another way, please contact us. We also invite you to check out our range of handicrafts that are sourced from vulnerable artists and communities across Myanmar available at alokacrafts.com. Any purchase will not only support these artisan communities, but also our nonprofits wider mission. That's aloka crafts spelled A L O K A C R A F T S craft s one word a local crafts.com Thank you so much for your kind consideration and support.