Transcript: Episode #77: Revolution as Art
Following is the full transcript for the interview with these guests, which appeared on November 8, 2021. This transcript was made possible by Artificial Intelligence (AI) and has not been checked by any human reader. Because of this, many of the words may not be accurate in this text. This is particularly true of speakers who have a stronger accent, as AI will make more mistakes interpreting and transcribing their words. For that reason, this transcript should not be cited in any article or document without checking the timestamp to confirm the exact words that the guest has really said.
Host 00:11
You're listening to a special version of the Insight Myanmar podcast covering the military coup and the ensuing protest movement that has developed during this crisis. we're ramping up the production of not only podcast episodes, but also our blog and other social media platforms. So we invite you to check these out as well. All the other projects that had been in progress prior to February have since been paused indefinitely, to focus entirely on this emergency. But for now, let's get into our show. This is the fifth show and our ongoing love letters to me and more series. In contrast to our main set of episodes, long form interviews with activists, authors, monastics and others engaged in Myanmar's ongoing crisis. This series surveys a range of guests who reflect on different aspects of the country and culture. Their observations are times heartwarming, other times inspiring, but they are always informative. Today's mainstream news coverage of Myanmar and the ongoing strife when there's any at all, tends to be one dimensional. So we hope this series presents an alternative multifaceted and dynamic view of the country. I'm especially excited by today's episode titled revolution as art in which we will be exploring the role of artists and the protest movement. That creativity intersects with political activism is not a new idea. Nor is it to healer to the ongoing crisis in Myanmar. The second century Roman philosopher Atticus, is reported to have written all art is in revolution against tyranny. The crew points out how artists are wired just a little bit differently than the rest of us, and that at any time or place, art can be used as a means of resistance against inequity, while promoting freedom in its own way. For example, in my country, United States in the 1960s, some of the best folk and rock songs ever in the genre were created to protest the Vietnam War and support civil rights movement. And of course, there's gynecol. Picasso's powerful painting illustrates the horrors of fascism and war. It's certainly the case that the present moment, the Burmese people are in the middle of a life or death struggle against an organized military that is attacking, shooting, bombing, raping, abducting, torturing and killing their friends and family every day. They're now leading the movement that insists upon their basic human rights, dignity and freedom, an ongoing conflict that is very soon approaching one year in length, with no end in sight. In such dire circumstances, one may wonder how could anyone possibly have the time and safe space to create art? And yet, as you're about to hear, that is exactly what's happening. And far from being a luxury It is perhaps needed now more than ever. Obviously, the question of just how art can help inspire the lives, moods and emotions of millions is especially relevant during these dark times and the golden land. So we pose this to our three upcoming guests all unique artists in the room right, who represent very different worlds and media. We first hear from a when he is the producer of the latest album from Rob against called Dick Council. A win assemble the dozen hip hop artists from across the country to spit rhymes calling out the military, while helping the people keep their spirits up during these difficult times. In fact, we should mention that the entire soundtrack for this episode features songs from this album. We encourage listeners to check out the album in detail after listening to this podcast, which you can do so by following the links provided in the show notes. Next, we talk to me. regular listeners will immediately recognize her voice as she has so eloquently been reading loud, short poems, letters and stories at the start of many of our episodes. Hear you'll hear her share one short story on the show as well. But more importantly, you'll also hear her tell her own story, one in which art fits prominently into. In addition to the power she brings this book in order, she has been drawing dozens of portraits of people around the world with proceeds going entirely to hoard her organization's fundraising mission to help people within the civil disobedience movement, as may also resides in Japan. She shares experiences about the response from the Japanese to the coup, as well as life among Burmese expats and exiles there. Finally, we hear from Alex, an Australian who undertook the normal backpacking tour across Myanmar several years ago, he was so taken with the country that he came back with a friend to help a rural school building project there. Alex was tasked with creating murals on the new walls going up
06:00
and we'll forget that forget never forget, never forget. Never forget. Never forget. Never forget. Never forget. Never forget. Never forget.
Host 06:12
And he fell back on that thing talent when the coup hit. Living in Montreal at the time, a city with a well known art scene featuring murals and graffiti on nearly every corner. Alex and a friend designed one mural depicting the country and showing his support for the democracy movement. With the central tribute to Angel, the young woman who was tragically killed earlier on in Mandalay. We should note that this episode is not in any way intended as conclusive in its commentary on the role of art artists and post cumbia Mar. But rather, it should be seen as the start of an ongoing conversation. Indeed, many of our past as well as upcoming episodes explore this thing in detail. For example, our most recent show was focused on Darko of the indie band side effect. Before that, we spent time with cha cha, from the punk band rebel riot, and the rapper 882021 from rap against Sunita. And we'll be releasing a discussion soon with the beloved underground artist bar was not here, who creates comics, paintings and sculpture and is currently in exile in Paris. Going back a little further. You might also remember our collaboration with GM forum D in sponsoring an art auction earlier in the year, with all proceeds going to Myanmar. By the way, I'm really happy to announce that we'll have yet another art auction coming up this December. So stay tuned for more information on that. But to give you a sneak preview now I'm really excited to report that some of the art being offered is going to be created by CD embers and hiding, displaying yet another interesting chapter of this intersection of art and revolution. Earlier we heard from a second century Roman philosopher, and I'd like to book in this talk with a well known contemporary voice Albert Einstein who said the revolution introduced me to art and in turn, art introduced me to the revolution. I think our listeners have already been well introduced to the democratic revolution currently underway in Myanmar. And I hope this episode further introduces everyone to more great art that is now being produced in resistance to the tomato and their cruelty. Stick around and enjoy what follows
08:24
never forget never forget never forget never forget never forget never forget never forget. Day a lovely day A Good Day
Host 09:31
thrilled here to be joined by CO a Winn who is the producer of the newest album from rap against to into title to council. Thanks so much for being here to join us, Colin.
Ko Aye Win 09:43
Hi, what's up? What's up everyone? Thanks for having me. Have me today and I really glad to be part of this. Podcast insight Myanmar.
Host 09:56
Yeah, so let's get right to your recent album called debt counseling. Start us off and tell us where that name came from.
Ko Aye Win 10:02
Yeah, is also the mockery. He of the military Honda, which is like his take me or say sick me is, is the war. And we try to change it into like, take, like detacher are like Dick, that style version of things.
Host 10:25
Right so sick Council is the Myanmar language word for like a military council because CIT is word for like military or soldier. And so you're changing the sit the dip, and it comes out as Dick counsel, which I think what that illustrates is that it's kind of simple and straightforward. But it's also showing that you're taking local minima references of things on the streets and the reality of what you're facing. But you're also showing an awareness and bringing in these different elements of Western pop culture and hip hop and, and bringing those two worlds together to just create a simple title. And I think that also illustrates what you try to do with some of the tracks and the music as well that you're bringing in these different influences of things that you guys are really facing in your life on the streets, local references, but then you're bringing in wider Western pop and hip hop, references and and symbols that other people know and you're combining these worlds together and some of these tracks. Oh, yeah,
Ko Aye Win 11:27
that makes sense. Because the like, like, it's like a new album, Ally alone, new music commit. And new music styles, a lot of music style, hip hop, especially new music, hip hop style, PSA include in this album, and like from the all those previous Hip Hop about that publish like before, but it's also the revolution, airborne plus, like, they got a lot of various artists, so they all came up with a different style. And then they have like an old style versions of the hip hop in back in the day style of Myanmar, but they also the like, fresh, fresh, no one and we tried to like make it like the like really emphasize on the better quality of the audio a lot. Rather than like we just like really release it. Release release with like a bigger promotion where we only emphasize on the really FSI on the audio part and we got 25 tracks in total submissions and we choose Charles among them. Yeah.
Host 12:42
Right and I think what's so interesting to me and listening to this and also your album before it dictators must die the previous album that rap against to produced is it's just making me reflect about how this is a 2021 protest and in 2007 in 1988 the energy and the influence and the awareness and the international understanding and and access that previous Burmese protesters had was different than 2021 So I wonder if you can talk about how the energy in the spirit and the International influences in this current year how that's different from what you've understood even if you weren't around of what the young protesters were doing in oh seven and 88
Ko Aye Win 13:31
So like I didn't born in 1988 but reach to 2007 we call like, yellow orange tree while golden golden yellow revolutions Yeah. But that tie was kind of kind of like totally different in between is the huge gap is because of the internet internet this was such a main key part is like holding on this revolutions and people can the communications wise like we have the upper hand and the the other previous revolutions like Ada and 2007 this one kind of like difference and apart from the last music digital mass died that we always we all live show the product footage that what was like the recent that protests and the crackdown, food ages and trying to show it and this one is more like a post scoop. But like post apocalypse styles of versions that we're not trying to bring back the the February things from the favorite festival that people keep the people protesting a lot of people on the streets and not kind of this house and I try and not to put that image on this album and that we try to make it like a, like the pure dystopia style verging on it. Yeah, back in the day, they got a lot of music came up, but it's hard to promote it as well. And for us now, it's like quite easy to promote with the Internet. And then we go ispahani spamming other people account with the sound of music to everyone. So and we try to do it like that way.
Host 15:41
Yeah, I mean, you're operating in this system where thing there's, there's almost total control of a totalitarian state, sometimes, terror tactics are used Internet is taken away. And so to be able to try to do what you're doing and the environment where you're operating. It's simply remarkable. And I wonder if you can tell us a bit about how this album even came to be. It's something that I can't even imagine the conditions under which you had to write the music, record, share, produce, get the album together? What was it like doing that, when everyone involved is actually living under a military coup, and there's no freedom anywhere, and people are just nervous and having to take precautions for their daily survival and safety?
Ko Aye Win 16:28
Yeah, are we go Can we already, like, take a good care about the safe safety things, and we always use, like, fake names and fake ID to walk with with us. And the problem is that we, we, it's really hard to promote the product. Because we cannot use our face, we got to use our real identity to reach out to more, more people, the people like in more intend to like the product, like if they see the like real videos, or someone who already he who shows himself out like and is more convincing in more convincing. Yeah. So plus, like we, if he approves you, other people, we can, sometimes we have to reveal ourselves, like who we are, in order to get the source from someone, or if we use the other identity, and people might turn down the offer because they don't trust or they have a security concern. And some people like they know, of course, if they know me, and who we who we really are the one might Dubai willing to help. So for the connection wise, the connections about the context that I have, I cannot use it all I only use by setting people that I can that they know who I am that who's ij and some people they don't so I try to we try to like keep it low key that about the thing is hot is hot, quite hot. Especially the internet probably is going on. I always like I've been down. So we everything that we got. So what are we doing? So we keep uploading on the cloud. So the people from the oversea die, who's inside the RHA as well that they can keep on doing doing on it. So yeah, that is taken on the internet that we all down for sure.
Host 18:43
Yeah, I can't imagine that. I mean, you and other rappers and producers and everyone, you've spent your whole lives building your careers, your names, your brands of who you are, what you represent what you've accomplished. And now at this moment, when that kind of currency that you've collected up to this time, is the most important you can't use it, you have to actually, for your own safety, disassociate your current work with everything you've done to get to this point and kind of give up and sacrifice who you've been in order to be safe with what you're doing now, which of course diminishes the reach and the influence
Ko Aye Win 19:19
Yeah, yeah, that's what I do two different things and one, one of my friends I he loves to he deftly do fly to PDF and then his name is Nova to is the winner of the voice Myanmar season two, he now like he for him is like quite easy. In terms of his living style in the PDF is quite very, very like rough I know but for the promotion wise is very free because he lives in the like safe zones. So he can just like yell yell out everything and he can do what the heck you want with regardless from the new making, making music and making music video as well. So yeah try we try to make it more like anonymous style and and help to help help other people do like making like a more like a platform for the other people to jump on a dream these days quite hard for them to, to make music and also the promotion as well.
Host 20:44
Right so you're part of this group rap against Toontown This is the second album that you produce, can you share a bit about what is this collective rap against? And how did it come on? How did it come together? And what is it trying to accomplish?
Ko Aye Win 20:59
Oh, yeah, no, well, my friend, when I asked Frank asked me about the goal about the RHA and and I just simply said, I mean, if me all I pass away, and you're done, but it's kind of like positive attitude to what the the the concept is they got the deco them they go like Honda is everywhere. DITA is like in every country, they got it not every country but in some other country that they got the digital so we have to keep on fighting on it. So like it's like a longtime and like longtime Papa so so and we in in a group that we try to split into 50% is for the International Digital's and another 50% is for the moderators for the waffles wave is separated. And so because nobody really an outside world is outside normals. I know, nobody, we don't really care. And they have their own problem and caught. So we had to make it like international as well, at the same time. Yeah. And we can try to put the gap in between of the International content with the bommies content. So people were notice more about what is going on here. And then they got more support. That's what we hope for. We stay trying to do it and doing it.
Host 22:35
Right. And I think what's so interesting is that hip hop as an art form has always been based on this feeling of authenticity, having credibility, being genuine to who you are, what your voice is, what your reality is. And over the years of hip hop that who was legitimate and what they have a right to represent and how much their music and their art reflects their actual life and their lived experience. That's been a big marker in terms of the just the success and legitimacy of the artist. And there is no greater legitimacy or authenticity than what you guys are doing now. I mean you what you are rapping about and what you are representing is entirely the conditions in which you're living. And I think it comes out more than ever in the statement that you released describing the album, you describe what you were doing. And at the end of the passage, you said, quote, we know we could be shot dead, but fuck it, we'd rather die than live in fear and quote, and that just epitomizes the life that you're living. This is nothing that you're trying to front this is nothing that you're trying to to bring in something to look macho or look look like you're tough. I mean that this is the absolute truth that you you know that this artistic expression could get you arrested or shot dead artists have been arrested and shot dead. And yet you're continuing to produce this art to represent the reality and the conditions you're living in. Because in your words, you'd rather die than live in fear. And I can't imagine any other hip hop artist in any place being more authentic or having more credibility than this Yeah,
Ko Aye Win 24:20
the reason why I really stick with the RFJ is like yeah, like I Yeah, or I'm scared I'm scared like it's really bad. Like they want a crackdown and they arrested people so I used to be like the wild wild boys in the during the protests and I tried to do everything that we could like when they crack down like people run and holding shoes and picking up tear gas and abating Barry gays like like like the others but when the crackdowns when they crack down so bad. And then when we can't do any more things and then also my groups like how far my groups are they if in my groups and also my friends among my friends that have all my friends like they fled to bank or saves Oh, some people did Join the Resistance falls so I just think it myself that if I cannot hold core gains or and do the direct way of like against the E dictatorships tan Honda so so this is still doing making our work at home and making our AGM making music album is the way mesh safer than the a dandy like really fighting against outside. So So yeah, I'm scared I was scared I made maybe like halfway if my balls dropped drop out in there is quite bad. So and then I kind of race my a life on the like Aniela Oz in the PDF and live in the forest. And I can't I can't do more than that. So I just tried to make it into the more in emphasize on the RFJ
Host 26:26
Yeah, and you have hip hop as a medium and you know, hip hop from its inception. And over time, depending on the conditions has always been aggressive and in your face and having a political message trying to speak truth to power trying to represent the actual conditions to people that don't want to hear them. And so talk a little bit about of all the mediums that are there all the artistic mediums, from graffiti, to painting to poetry, all the different ways that artists can represent themselves right now. You are pursuing hip hop and you are promoting Hip Hop so talk a little bit about why this medium specifically Hip Hop why it's so important right now and what the role of hip hop during the revolution can be.
Ko Aye Win 27:16
Yeah, so like the the main thing that like hip hop is when it evolve is supposed to be like that way do you know the hip hop is dead by the NAS is The instrumental is by the African Bambara from the Zulu Nations so like the way they make hip hop back in a day in New York Bronx is kind of like a protecting the younger people from the street to get away from those drugs and also gun violence and and every situations to get it out from the making relief making an art form that we all unite and protect protect each other and we speak out what's the reality is, and what you feel about. So the most of the rebels in this Dickcouncil album, in an interview they said like we don't know about the politics but I we just need to speak out. Speak out for that. Before the coop I was a B boy. So I like to battle a lot. but not anymore. Like I have a lot of like operations back in time. And now I tried to go to more into music. Yeah. So my my way of Title style is small, like, battling moves. So it's really good too. Because I know you know, like, you know, hip hop rap battle, they always like provoke each other and talk to each other. So how about we switch the arrow direction to the take on Dick council, and the military Junta or Min Aung Hlaing or whoever, like every tyrant across the globe. So that's uh, yeah, at what it is. Hip hop is good. They're like, they have like their own music, their art, their fashion, and they have like, kind of like a proper package for them to start their own style. And so is this that media is quiet, like acceptable and really go for the artists? And
Alex 30:26
yeah
Host 30:33
yeah, I'm glad you mentioned that because that was something else I noticed when I was listening to this album and reading the description of it was that, traditionally in Myanmar, and I don't, I don't just mean traditionally, in the 21st or 20th century, I mean, like, traditionally, in the last 100, last 1000 years, there's this, the way that that conservative hierarchical, traditional Myanmar society is constructed, is the king or the ruler just has this built in respect. I mean, he has this power, this this fear, and that's how he rules and, and it's not, it's partly in the terror tactics that his soldiers will carry out. And it's partly just in his persona of being this, somewhat of a divinely Buddhist endowed king with great power armies and karma, that is able to withstand all of the resistance and he from his past lives, he's amassed so much power that he's able to withstand anything. And these this title and artwork and lyrics, you're ridiculing him, You're tearing him apart, you're not showing any respect, you're not showing any fear. You're, you're attacking him mercilessly. And so it just really struck me that you're using this adversarial battle form of hip hop to tear down someone who's not used to be not used to being spoken this way, not only in current times, but going back 100 or 1000 years. The the young people at the bottom who are nobodies are not supposed to be speaking like this to someone with power. And yet that's exactly what hip hop is. In my country. Hip Hop developed from the disenfranchise the younger black people in the ghettos that were speaking in ways that they weren't supposed to but they were doing it anyway to represent their reality to the people who didn't want to hear it and that's what you're doing now in the most powerful way.
Ko Aye Win 32:31
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, does that that's That's correct. Yeah, that's exactly what we are trying to accomplish and yeah, I did a one project and so we I tried to record the the chanting of the protest plus swearing at Min Aung Hlaing and all so during the record sessions, and I I asked is is good to say that because it's too much swearing a lot and then my friends like all those younger people in the studio they said like, I just say, just say they don't care. Yeah, just do it. So like, and from that point that they motivate me to like keep on like, they don't give a as to them. Yeah.
Host 33:24
Right yeah. And that that definitely shows
Ko Aye Win 33:26
Yeah, like just tear down it Yeah. Tearing down them keep on tearing down luckily that the album was released two days before the drive by shooting video on internet and so we're so glad that we were released and quite earlier. it's like kind of like a lucky draw, like if we promote one going to produce one thing on day on the day that might happens also, so that the internet war is I think about like we are like a propaganda war machine for the freedom.
Host 34:12
Right. And have you heard much about the response on the military or the police side? Do they know about the album release? Are they looking for the people who did it?
Ko Aye Win 34:21
I think now not yet. And not yet. I think so like so far, so good. And I yeah, they won't really know who we are at the moment. And I really like salute to Flo Gross, who sang inside the digital mass die music representative for the Maasai, and he still living in the bowl and he does go around he's just keep showing up the histories and fix it like he just going around. He goes by and nothing happen and he even wasn't even race race fans for the PDF as well. And then I don't know how he doing it that yeah, there's kind of like if he got caught and you can do anything anymore so so just better be Be careful every time
Host 35:19
yeah in February and March we saw videos of artists going out and and just being public you know drawing graffiti or having open poetry or hip hop or punk that were just kind of live free concerts or Dance Choreography there's the famous Michael Jackson they don't care about us and Sue Sue Botha Of course nothing like that has happened for a long time and we're not so powerful when it did and that's why it got shut down you'd be arrested or shot in the head if you went out and tried to to be a an artist in a public space these days.
Ko Aye Win 36:09
Yeah, true. True. So like right now we try to think about like further take also albums so that we really like have like a video feed you have video production. So right now we already show some so we try to make it like a flashmob idea. Render and we try to follow me on the street dancing on the street by now with the whole group maybe just alone. And we I tried to create it, but some people are they 20 down because they still sketch or and so yeah, like they were those well coming up soon. Yeah.
Host 36:51
Okay, so for some of our listeners who might not be able to understand either the language for the songs in Burmese or even if there's some some English language, there could be some local references or speaking to the the reality and the current conditions that people outside of Myanmar wouldn't be able to get. I wonder if you can pick a song or two from the album that you really liked and just break it down for us just tell us why you liked the song and what they were trying to do and what they were trying to express
Ko Aye Win 37:25
yeah I don't know like so fast I wonder we call them music before we launch a lot of people like Lee Emil by age 2021 Ruffian is a very fast track of the airborne so the way it's like very like new style and people really like it because nobody ever had this kind of style in Yama language plus with the A English the wise i Well my favorite The best one is the last song is called Luna is very short track like only two minutes and 30 seconds. Yeah, is the whole sound is about the shoe of life. And everybody like it because they all can relate to the sound, especially in Yama. Yama in Yama, Zhang people they like the song a lot. But that's how it's not really battling mood. Like all those like Ollie a fast track and second track. You know, that lesson is like very chill down and Squire I wish you our heart a lot. And I like never forget because like because of the a very fast track fastball is is saying by catching language. So I never heard of that before. And it sounds so cool. I think it's closer Bobby's language. Rapid Eye. Yeah. Yeah. And I like the we fight daily is sounds like a four minute petrify album style, or kind of like origins soundtrack from the movie style transformer sheets in the whole soundtrack is English. Yeah. Yeah. I like that one too.
Host 39:36
Yeah, the diversity you have on there is great. I mean, as you mentioned, you have kind of slow ballads. You have old traditional hip hop, you have battle style hip hop, you have diversity in background, I didn't know that there was a kitchen singer. So that's great that you have the the different, different languages and ethnicities represented. You mentioned how there's messaging towards Myanmar dictators and towards outer dictators. So you you're showing an awareness of similar situations that other people are also facing. And then you also have have a couple tracks from women on there. And that that was awesome. I heard one of the ones from from one of the, the female rappers and I thought that was that was really cool the track and the style and everything.
Ko Aye Win 40:16
Yeah, yeah. So the female track so, yeah. Like nobody. I know, it says like, I just trying to be honest, like when we call for the submission like there's no female artists inside submission. So I just like we try to reach out someone by like, we personally know. Tell how to rap for this album. Yeah. And not even featuring. Yeah, add the PSA. During the title. Like, we asked him for the music that first month of the process. So that I was, is the third wave of the COVID away from Yama people suffer a lot during the movie is like, the whole entire phase Sophie is like arbitrary notice. Yeah. Yeah. And then everybody like, I think like kind of like, I tie it I reach out to some other artists as well. So like they just like the some, some representatives they even cry. As I said, I give up a lot of artists 10 down not because of this guy, I think and I think side they have a difficulty about their life. So they need to choose the walking lifestyle or they need to figure out for to put the food on the table. Yeah, so I think I understand that. So at least I we still like keep on running as an RA J. And so everybody can rely on us.
Host 42:08
Right now that's and that's great work that you do. And that brings up a wider point before we talked about the role of hip hop and hip hop artists. If we just look at the role of artists what is what is the role during this revolution of the creators the the the artistic minds, whatever vocation they're doing, whether it's music or painting or dance or whatever? And for those people that are that have that artistic ability, what is the role of art during revolution? And one of the reasons I asked you is that this episode, all of the guests we have are looking at this question from a different angle examining the role of art at the time of revolution so in your mind, what is the role of an artist
Ko Aye Win 42:53
like now is I really good to make art right now because it's so clear to do art and everybody is in equilibrium moment equal equal equal standard right now there's like you don't need to do art to do for the revolution just like anything but if you're doing art with the revolution because you are the artist is easy we mesh better but also Yeah, I was like just keep doing it. Then like and I today like I asked that if we stay I asked someone that if you stay have hope for the winning and then and then they been doing the politics for like so many years since long ago and then and they said we have Hoss from the beginning we thought we already thought we have how we have hold that we we believe that we were waiting one day that's why we keep on doing it doing it
Alex 44:06
yeah
Ko Aye Win 44:08
luckily I don't have so much power down like other people some people they they have family they have they got kids and they got this girl they need they have someone to take take care of but for me I'm just like long long guy so just taking myself so I can do freely that what I want to do right now. So is I really ties ties wherever the energy source or the god or yeah and the just glad that I love to I got a chance to do those kinds of art and then I won't get those kinds of experience in my life like never again so. So that's what I feel about you About About the my rules are disease final.
Host 45:07
Yeah, and also unfortunately the regime has really gone after artists with great vengeance and, and terror. The Many artists have been killed in the streets or arrested, tortured or disappeared or still in prisons, many are in deep undercover and deep hiding. Why do you think the military is so concerned and afraid of artists and freedom of expression at this time?
Ko Aye Win 45:34
Because I it's about the soft power, soft power, and then also the social change through art. So it's definitely definitely it is but we cannot show the results like okay, we do publish his album and do those kinds of amount of people change and join the CDN or, you know, like they they listen the music and we're gonna show how many people jam boys join the PDF after listen to this album. Those are like really emotional stats, but it's really he walks and everyday really scared and they really know all the propaganda is like, while the main things and I, I think that like because of the Fourth Industrial Revolution, the internet so of course, I got a lot of fake news and fake news and hate speech in on Facebook. So but if he when I think like if he weighing on the internet at the crown, also wing, that's what I what I feel that way. Well, no. Yeah.
Host 46:56
So finally, the work that you produced is not just music, but you also have some great artwork. For the album, can you describe a bit for listeners who drew some of the artwork and what it depicts
Ko Aye Win 47:13
the intro the angel, the artwork that is done by two machines, a group or like 2d A group of 2d animation artists in town and also jam boys and like, around 1920 They read they really go and they always I can see his Facebook stories that they always like, how do I say that I depress during these time, because everybody sometimes we i i depressed too. Because like, feeling like, like we lost hope we lost freedom. Just that we don't want to let that happen. So I keep on stick with these producing albums. But the intro music is done by my friends and also like I was the one that also arranging the music because like I came from the dance background and yeah, the music's like I can't do a lot of things so and I got a lot of friends that who are really good at it so and it's from the house I mean like that because I live a mile with the music producers and rappers so they helped me out for the very intro part that I want to do it and he they just produce it on the spot I just sit beside and I asked him why like and what I don't like and he just tried to show me they try to we try to get a vibe together and make a intro music's style. And for me, I'm more into the visual production. I am the choreographer as well. So I like to choreograph a lot. So right now it's not a good to a bad bad back. Now is a good time now because anybody can go and make a video flaming unlike the COVID to the COVID. So there's no chance to go out at all. Yeah, by not on the public. No at the public only at the like private garage or studios. And we try to try to extend our creative idea and yeah,
Host 49:42
that's great. And I definitely encourage listeners to check out that artwork I saw a couple of pieces one was a just a simple bullet and microphone jack coming head to head showing the the confrontation between music and violence and that was really cool. And of course you're out your album cover is showing a a soldier's very graphic and dramatic showing the soldier being struck by a bullet and half of his face being being a skeleton. So very, very intense depictions that you have. And I also encourage listeners to check out the full album, we've been so fortunate to be able to play tracks throughout this episode to give a feel for what these artists are doing. But check out the links in the show notes to be able to see where you can access and support this great work that all of all of you guys have been doing. So it's been great to have you on to explore just what you're doing with hip hop and what the artists are doing with their creative freedom of expression. Or, of course, they don't have a freedom of expression, but how they're, they're trying anyway to, to try to produce and to share from their reality. So I really think the time that you spent in sharing about this project,
Ko Aye Win 51:04
so like, the last not least, I have to say is that yeah, they just keep support. And like for the Yamaha revolutions is gonna be a great example of like, gradings over for not only for the future generations, and only them Yemma also the for the war that hound younger people bring up, revolution and win if we win. I mean, if you win the revolution, while younger people bring up the fire when the revolutions for the good cause. So, yeah, keep doing at least one thing for the revolution, no matter what, even those die, no matter how small, how small, how big, but just be careful for the safety. And yeah, try not to get distracted from the internet. Shit, because you have to, you need to have a strong heart and strong feeling and a straight mindset on the pure pure mindset on the revolution. That's like, yeah, the music is like we I think like I can I I think we can say so it's kind of like a huge milestone for the bommies Hip Hop era. And so so like, apart from apart for, like after this album like everyone like and him Yeah, Jamar, I can make better music for the revolutions more and more. And I keep on thriving and keep on fighting as your peace, love unity and having fun at the
53:00
56 feet deep underground, let the people breathe oxygen heavy time, up to one time.
Host 53:36
I'm so pleased to be joined now by Mei who is a Burmese person living in Japan. And we're going to check in with her about some of her art and also what's happening in Japan now. So may thanks so much for joining us.
May 53:51
Thank you for having me.
Host 53:53
So first of all, we have to get it out of the way and say if your voice sounds familiar, which well as we start talking a little further for our listeners, you are the person who has been doing this excellent, amazing job of reading the various poems and letters and stories and other submissions and things you have found as well other submissions that have come that often appear in the start or in the middle of the interviews on the episode. So it's really great to check in and have listeners be able to get to know the person behind the voice that has animated so much of these short, five minute segments.
May 54:33
Thank you very much. It's been a pleasure for me to read all these. Well, I would say pleasure but it's also quite emotional at times for me to read all these letters and poems as well but it's been a really great opportunity and I'm really glad I get to be a part of your podcast it this way. I'm glad to be here.
Host 54:57
I think that emotion comes through I think that kind of raw authenticity combined with your real talent for voice inflection and being able to to hit the right marks on the right words, it's really in the wonderful job that our sound engineer Mike does, and being able to select the different background tracks to really bring out the quality to a greater extent, of course, we have to thank the original writers, it's been such a wonderful way we've been able to add feeling and sense of reality to what's going on. And it's, and it's great to get the chance to check in and talk to you because you've been the actual voice behind all those. So people who have heard you before, and we'll hear you on future episodes, we'll get to learn a little about you.
55:40
Alright, thank you. Yeah, yeah.
Host 55:43
So you are in Japan, which is a place dear to my heart. Because as we've talked before, I've spent a few years there as well, we share a deep love of own sense, which I'm very jealous you get to go to and I can't. But in any case, tell us a bit about as far as you're comfortable. How you got to Japan and what you're doing there.
May 56:03
Okay, well, I got to Japan, I've been in Japan for about three years now. And I'm here, as an assistant professor teaching English at a university in one of the universities in in Japan, just sort of, never dreamed of coming to Japan, really, I was working in one of the Southeast Asian countries prior to Japan, and I was looking for a new place a new country to work in. And Japan was not on my radar. But I went to a conference and I was doing a presentation. And after I finished this presentation, a group of people came up to me, and they give me their contact details. And they said that they really enjoyed the presentation. And they were wondering if I would be interested in applying for a job at their university, which I did. And that's how I got here.
Host 56:57
That's great. And how has the transition been coming from Myanmar going to another Asian nation, although very different climate and culture, how has been settling into Japan and being there now going on three years,
May 57:11
the transition has been a lot smoother than I expected. Because when I was in the previous context, I think there were a lot of racist racism that I experienced as a Burmese person living in the prayer context. But in Japan, even though I've heard horrible stories of how people are discriminated in Japan, I've not experienced that. And that has been a very positive thing for me, I've actually found really good supportive people. In the education field in Japan, I've been able to present more joint in, you know, writing research papers and books and things like that. So I've been really happy professionally. And personally, I found the transition a little bit difficult, because it's just very quiet. And it's quiet, not only in the sense that it's quiet on a, on a daily basis, it's quiet in the evenings. It's quiet when I come back home. Also, it's maybe because I'm living in the outskirts of a big city, perhaps. But the just transition from having a very noisy atmosphere, living in a very noisy atmosphere to a very quiet place has been tough. But it is impossible not to fall in love with Japan, the quietness is actually the most calming, and it's something that you never thought you needed.
Host 58:42
That's, that's great. And how is the Burmese community there? Is there? Is there much of a Burmese community in different cities? Or if there is what are the kinds of Burmese who are coming to settle there? What work are they doing? Or have you found any Burmese restaurants or supermarkets.
May 58:57
So I live in a smaller city, so we don't really have a huge Burmese community. But there are a lot of Burmese students studying in the in the university but are not on the same campus as mine. But if we go to a bigger city, which is about two and a half hours away from our, from the city I'm living in there are Burmese restaurants. And there is a huge Burmese community there. So it's like, we do have a community if we want to do reach out and join. But if we want to stay outside of the community also we're able to do it. So I'm actually in a very good position to either connected or get disconnected, I guess.
Host 59:41
Hmm, that's great. So that's a little bit of the background of your time in Japan. And then of course, a couple of years into your stay. We had this disastrous coup that was initiated on February 1 And we've spoken to several other people on the podcast who have been Burmese expats abroad and check in about the their feelings and emotions of what it was like being disconnected from the country as it was going through such turmoil. What has the process been like for you in these past going on nine months now?
May 1:00:11
Um, frankly, it's been, it's been devastating really. I've lost family members because of COVID situation in Burma. I just, I think there's also this like realization that even though I have left the country quite a long time ago, and I've not lived back there, I've only visited, there's still such a strong sense of what home is and home is his Myanmar home is Burma home is Yangon. For me, and I'm devastated every single day. Since the coup to find out that people are people, people's lives and futures have been stolen. And it has, it has had a great impact on my daily life here.
Host 1:01:00
How so what kind of impact
May 1:01:04
I just find everything to be more intense. There's, if I Japan's very safe as you know, if I take a walk around the block at 11 o clock, because I can't sleep, I feel safety, nothing else, but safety and peace. But that's suddenly and that's suddenly a luxury now, because many people can do that in my country, not even in the broad daylight. And that realization is very intense. When I go to supermarkets and see abundance of food, you know, 20 varieties of rice grains, I feel very sad, because that's not something that people in my country are able to experience. I'm a teacher at the university, I teach 1718 year olds every day, I see them reaching for their dreams everyday having a really good time in the lessons and the classes that we've planned for them. And I see their happiness and their hopeful futures. And I compare it to the youth in my country, and I feel pain for the people in my country, we've got generations of people who are now feeling hopeless because of the coup. And that is, again, an intense feeling of you know, comparing how horrible things are back home and how things could be looking at things here.
Host 1:02:28
Right, I understand. And I'm sorry to hear that. That's obviously the reality for many people. Now. You I know that you've responded in a couple of different ways to this in terms of the actions you've actually done. One is fundraising, which we'll get to in a moment. And the other, which actually coincides with fundraising is art. And I would say that one of the artistic things you do as for this podcast is the readings that you give that that are an oral audio form of art, which is quite beautiful, and how things are imparted. But you also do other kinds of art. So can you share a bit about your background as an artist and what you've done as an artist since February?
May 1:03:10
Okay. So before the coup, I drew a lot, and I just drew for fun, it was a relaxing thing. But when the coup started, I started donating a lot of my income to causes because the coup began and the civil disobedience started and, and that's how I actually got in touch with my organization, when I was donating a lot of my income to CDM. And I realized that we need more income, of course, we need more funds. And one of the ways to get it is through artwork, because I know that people would be happy to donate more if I provided their portraits. And I just started with a drawing people that I admire, and those start with the poets. And that's how the poem readings actually became a thing for me. And then I started drawing the the youth leaders, and I think one of the most I guess, popular tweets that I've made was when I drew these Assan and, and everybody sort of like so liked it, and I started drawing other people also and I, when I got like a few followers on Twitter, I just started tweeting that I would draw portraits in exchange for people who wanted to support the civil disobedience movement. If they donated $100. and above, then I will draw their portraits and that's how I got started.
Host 1:04:46
Right. And so your main art has been drawing people's portraits and then the donation they give for that then goes to your the organization that you're involved with. Yes, yes. Yeah, right. And What is it? So before you did art as a relaxing activity, but it's now becoming something of a profession, even though the proceeds are going for donation, how has it been like to use art for this way at this time?
May 1:05:12
I think it's great. In a way, I am very grateful that I have this ability to draw because through my artwork, I've been able to raise quite a lot of funds over the past months. And these funds have been very useful, crucial for a lot of the people in the civil disobedience movement and other causes. So very grateful for this opportunity. I'm very grateful that people are willing to donate money in exchange for my artwork. I'm very humbled by it.
Host 1:05:46
Right, and as you've drawn more of the art, has that made you reflect just about the role that art has overall in the protest movement. And you're, of course, drawing art on your side outside the country, which is very different from some of the artists that are happening in Myanmar itself. But it is connected by artists that are producing work for the good of the revolution. And what is that made you reflect on and the role of art at this time?
May 1:06:16
Artists very important, I think, even through these difficult times, we have to remember that Burma is a not just a country of turmoil and conflict. We're not just people who are always in you know, in need of help. We are a people of diverse backgrounds. And we have a rich culture, we have amazing artists who are able to promote our country in different ways. I think it just want to do like sort of see, wanted people to see the boom is not just a failed state, as the media is, you know, talking about, there are other parts of it that are important, equally important, as well. And of course, the artists inside of the country are, there are a lot of the artists who are using their artwork to get donations and donating back just like I'm doing as well. And it's just, it's, it's a great way for us to get our voices heard. It's not just about words, images also make a lot of differences in our lives. And I think it reached to a different audience. And we need all of those. Not just voices, but artwork, but literature, everything to go out there to show that this is Burma. And I think, yeah, so art artists, very important. I am happy to promote any artist, if I have a chance to promote any artists, I do. So on my twitter as well.
Host 1:07:54
Right and following the different artists in Myanmar, which ones have stood out to you and really spoke to you whether that art is actually something like painting or drawing like you whether it's music or dance or whatever form that art takes literature. You mentioned, whatever form the artists taking, which artists and their works have really spoken to you that have been coming from Myanmar in the country since the coup.
May 1:08:19
That's a very, very good question. And I am scrolling through my phone as I attempt to buy time for myself, because I'm very bad with names and there's one artist that I have been very actively following. And I cannot for the life of me remember his name, but I have posted about him a couple of times on my Twitter. He makes these amazing drawings, which are oil paintings, but they are so realistic, but they somehow bring in a lot of nostalgia because he usually paints the Yangon scenes, like the train station, or the people going up the stairs to the pagoda or the nuns walking in the in broad daylight under the sun and it's just just very realistic, but also very nostalgic sort of feeling for me and I've been following for quite a while I cannot afford his paintings. I bet they are expensive, but I do promote for him quite a lot on Twitter. I don't know him personally. But that's just one of the artists that I've been following. But a lot of the artists in Burma are very good, very talented, but they do not use social media widely like the other artists from different countries are using. So a lot of the artists you would have to search for the galleries on get the gallery pages on Facebook to discover them and it takes a while for people who are you know if you cannot Emmys if you can't read Burmese language, then that's a problem.
Host 1:10:05
Right? There have been so much art that came out and one person explained this to me by mentioning that a lot of these artists that are emerging now were trapped somewhat before in like PR or other kinds of more, more commercial jobs that actually paid because a lot of art doesn't doesn't pay the bills, unfortunately, and because they were freed from their work, which is also unfortunate, but that did free them up to be able to express themselves as never before. And so there is all this kind of potential of talent that was hidden there that has just come out in every form one can imagine. And I think for me, one of the things I've been most affected by is, I don't know who did it. I've tried to find out who actually made this video. But it's just kind of a montage video of the the song. This is war by 30 Seconds to Mars, I'm not sure if you've seen that it came out, like in the first month of the coup. And it's just showing a number of people from different professions and backgrounds that are coming together, to fight the revolution and to to do whatever it takes. And it's just, it's, uh, you know, I must have seen it 2030 times, every time I see it, I cry I and sometimes when I need to get motivated, even after all these months, I'll just turn that on for five minutes. And it just, it does the trick, it just it is it brings together so much of the things that drive me and that move me. I think the other one has been and again, I'm not sure I can't quite remember the name of this. But it was and this is this one was very surprising. It means it did. It was interpretive dance. And I don't know anything about interpretive dance, I think I honestly find it kind of boring, I don't really understand it, it's kind of something you see mocked a lot in cetera, et live or whatnot. But it was a number of interpretive dancers around the world that were that were responding to a Burmese song. And the artist who did the song was the one that organized it, he explained the meaning of the words of the song. And there's just something about the way that all these dancers are moving in just the there's just a sorrow and a, and a pain and an openness, that vulnerability that's being expressed as the song plays. That's also both of those have just had extraordinary impacts on me.
May 1:12:31
I feel like I should ask these links from you. Because I am not familiar with both of these videos that you're talking about.
Host 1:12:39
We'll put them we'll put them in the links, and I'll send them to you as well. And yeah, there's just there's so much floating around here. And that brings up the question of what role do you think art plays in a revolution like this? And I think you touched upon this before. But your answer before was more to what is the artist expressing about the Burmese people to the outside world who might not be seeing them as three dimensional people or as as complex and nuanced as, as in other countries? But looking internally, what is the role that you think the artist is playing towards those that are struggling, that are facing this despair and the suppression and that are trying to carry on day after day? What is the role of the artist in that context?
May 1:13:26
It brings in a very realistic picture of what's happening to people, regular people, especially the poets, the poems, I think I'm more touched by the poems that I've been reading, reading from the, the poem, The poets that we've lost in this revolution, the poets who are incarcerated at this moment, and all these poems really speak volumes about the situation in in Burma, I think, in this revolution, art and politics are intertwined. We can see the people's reaction to this revolution through poetry, and also artwork. These are the ways that people are expressing themselves and I think there's just immense impact in allowing, like, just rallying a lot of people to come together. There's not a lot of time for people to read, you know, long text and long manifestos of what this revolution mean. But if you read a poem, if you see an artwork, there's an instant reaction, just like you were saying, when you were listening to the the interpretive dance or the music that comes out from it, and you're motivated and your spirits are renewed, and you're ready to continue on and that's the same thing for us. We are able to communicate through this medium In a way that words are not able to express, I think, and there's just, there's just immense power in being able to visualize the pain. And I think this is the reason why the military also are, you know, make it a point to kill poets who are able to incite such revolutionary spirit among the people, they do not want anybody to be motivated to be inspirational to become brave by a few words, and they're so afraid of that. So this kind of power for somebody to be able to use words to instigate the images to instigate such revolution is a scary thing for them. That's why they've been hunting down poets, anybody who's who's able to rally people really?
Host 1:15:58
That's a great answer. And it made me think that this role of art that you mentioned, isn't this the role of art at any time, place or moment in human history, but even more so during the revolution, even more. So at the time where the stakes are so high, it perhaps isn't that art is playing a different role than it plays in any other moment, any other place, but just that the importance and value of that role have taken on stakes that it never does during normal times.
May 1:16:28
Right. And these artists are also from very similar backgrounds to most of the people in our country, and what they say reflect very accurately of what we are feeling as regular people too. And that just, you know, it's a, it's a big connection.
Host 1:16:48
I think that's really true, because I'm obviously not fluent in Burmese in the language or the culture. But from the little I do understand, at times, and from the way things have been explained to me, in certain instances, there have been examples of very localized language and expression and references used, that could only really be understood as profoundly to those that are in the same locale that immediately it strikes them. And this is bringing to mind to me a podcast that we did with two people who ran a, a Facebook page that was exploring Burmese memes, online internet memes, and the reason for it was that these these, whether they were memes, or at that time protest signs, which are not so common anymore, but they were expressing this extraordinary amount of nuance and intelligence and humor, and, and contrasting different ideas and putting their hopes out. And they simply weren't being understood by the international community, because they were using such localized motifs and references and everything else. And in that way, one could argue that even these these kind of silly online memes that are just getting a laugh, are also tapping into that same motivation of the artist and freedom of expression and speaking truth to power by referring beautifully and courageously to symbols and things on the ground that only those in that community will be able to get, and they'll instantly get them and it will instantly trigger them in ways that, as you said before, in your answer, speak more than many, many words put together.
May 1:18:28
Right? Yes, exactly. It's been. It's, you know, Burmese people are very resilient. We've gone through so many in these past decades. And humor is one way that people have been able to go through such hardships and memes are an important part of this revolution. Because how can you carry on through these hardships? If you're not able to laugh at a few things?
Host 1:18:56
Right, right. So get into your fundraising, you and the the portraits that you make and the donations you get you are involved in an organization's become quite active. Can you share a bit as far as you're comfortable about what this organization is and what they have tried to do since February?
May 1:19:16
Okay. So our organization is called the International Society of Myanmar scholars and professionals. I'm not one of the founders. When I joined the group. It was already founded by a couple of people, mostly doctors, from Myanmar, but they were all located all over the world, some inside of Myanmar, some outside of Myanmar, all over basically, and there are many of us. And we started this project, which was one of the biggest projects in this coup, the one to one CDM campaign where they were connecting the CDM supporters with their CDM heroes, and they get to talk to them. You can you know, have a chat with them. If you wanted to. And you can support them. And that's how like we've been able to sustain helping about 1700 people for all these months starting the starting February. So that's one of the biggest projects that I as MSB has done. We've also started, I think there are quite a lot of medical doctors in our organization. And they've worked together very closely with the Ministry of Health under an ug, and they've been spearheading this project called the mental health services where they give like tele mental health services to people who are going through trauma and sexual violence in this cool during this cool, and that's one of the biggest project. And the other part of the project is the connect one to one project where we sell tote bags. And some of the artists who are also part of our organization draw the pictures and caricatures and we make tote bags and grocery bags and we sell them. And whatever profit we get from these projects, we put them into our one to one CDM campaign. And the last thing that we do is advocacy. There's a team of people who are working day and night, to sign petitions to talk about issues to raise awareness, and things like that. And they do quite a lot of meetings and advocacies. And, and all sorts, which I'm not a part of, because that's tight, tight, tight. That's very time consuming. And I'm unable to give that much time with my full time job. But because we are a big organization, different people play different roles, according to their strengths and backgrounds. And these are some of the projects that we've been able to do. And I play the role of the fundraiser in my organization, I raise funds as much as I can. And I also tried to bring in a lot of educational resources to our campaign. So one of the latest projects that I've done is, I've connected some a Japanese university project, it's called the International virtual exchange project. And we are giving eight week English courses have English course to students from Myanmar. And we've already sort of set up a scholarship fund for students who are unable to afford Dubai data packages as well. And it's starting it already started last week. So it's one week into the course and the project. And we're very happy with the results. A lot of the students have been able to join, and they're able to meet students from other countries as well.
Host 1:22:52
That's great to hear. And that's so much work and so many people that are involved in supporting this in great ways. And I guess if there's any positive byproduct that's come from such a disastrous event taking place, it's been this outpouring of volunteerism, and giving from so many sectors within and outside of Burma by Burmese, as well as by foreigners and allies that are standing by. And so it's quite heartwarming to hear of how many people are giving so much even as they have full time jobs, and they're engaged in everything else in their life.
May 1:23:26
Definitely, I take inspiration from all of my group members, I know that people are working day and night, sometimes, of course, we all take breaks, we must take breaks, if we want to be useful in this revolution, we have to be on our best mental health, if we want to continue on as useful human beings, and we do take breaks. But because it's a big organization, if I'm taking a break, there are other people who are continuing and if other people are taking a break, I'm continuing. So it's a great source of inspiration.
Host 1:24:00
Right. And with that fundraising, we've also talked about how you're at the beginning, it was more going towards CDM that was one of the initial hopes of what might be able to make the state ungovernable and, and military not able to control it. And that has had its own success up to a point and there now has been more focus on PDFs. And you've been involved more in doing fundraising to support those PDFs. And I'm sure you like most of us never imagined that there would be certain kinds of conversations and engagements that we would be involved in yet here we are now and so um, and this is something I should also mention that by those that are not really understanding the conflict and that are privileged or distanced or detached in some way, are not really understanding the stage that it's at. And so I'm wondering from your point of view, what it's been like to start to take on fundraising for something that wasn't just helping those that were staying home, but we're actually starting to support those that were looking at offenses against the Burmese military and, and then how you got into that, and how that feels where you're at now with the fundraising that you're doing.
May 1:25:25
Okay? It's it's a bizarre feeling that I never imagined that I will be in meetings where we'll be talking about buying certain things to protect people. But the whole objective of me joining this revolution is that I want to help us win, I want to help us defeat the military. And we're fighting evil, the evil that never stops. The evil That's so cruel, we've seen time and again, young people and all people, people from all different backgrounds, and different social status is being killed tortured horribly, the only way to protect them is to stop this. And one of the ways to protect is is for us to find funding so that we can help them continue this fight. And it is inevitable for me the way I see it, do, you know go from one type of fundraising to the next for me, I don't think that I've changed my idea of this. In this revolution, I want to protect people. And this is what I'm doing. And if if this means that I would have to be in a situation in meetings where I'm a little bit out of debt, it's fine, I am able to do it, I will do it. It's kind of weird. Of course, sometimes when you're sitting in Starbucks and drawing a portrait, and you realize that this $500 is going to go to a go to procuring a weapon. That's a kind of a weird feeling. In my daily life, I am an educator. But in the evenings when I'm drawing, I'm supporting something else. But I think what I would like people who are so distance from our situation to understand is that we're not violent. We want peace. And in order for us to get peace, we unfortunately will have to fight. And that's what we're doing. We're going towards peace. That's why we're doing this.
Host 1:27:26
Well said thank you. So we began the conversation talking about your place in Japan, and what things were like before the coup there. And I'd like to finish our talk by returning there, because we talked a bit about how you've been doing in Japan, your journey, but not so much about the country itself. And I think we've been exploring some of the other places where Burmese expats and allies have lived, we haven't learned so much about Japan, we haven't focused on that for our listeners. So I wonder if you can start off first by sharing a bit about what you find of Japanese reactions, whether those are reactions of Friends of the public, how much you find the public informed or supportive. And then what you know, of higher up in terms of Japanese politicians and leadership?
May 1:28:20
Okay, great question. I've got answers for all these different level, right. So in terms of the Japanese public, the news about Burma do not reach them, because the most Japanese people don't actually read Japanese news. And they they do reach out nice news. But most of the news articles are in English when it comes to things concerning about Burma. So they're not translated enough. So people are not well informed about this. They know that there's something going on in the country. But that's it. That's just about it. So we need more people to translate in English, we need more Japanese reporters, we need more people who speak Japanese language proficiently to raise awareness. And I think they are doing it quite well in big cities, like in Tokyo. But in smaller cities like mine, like where I live, it's been very difficult. And we have been doing a lot of awareness campaigns by going to Facebook language exchange groups and talking to different various like, Amnesty International in Tokyo and things like that we've been doing so much to raise awareness. Still, that's not enough because we're not able to reach the wider general public. And I think that it also, you know, is very reflective in my classes when I talk about where where I'm from, and my students are very surprised to see hear about what's been happening and they've been moved so much. Some of my students have started a Twitter account, and also an Instagram to explain about what's happening in Burma for their peers, and I've been very, I'm very touched by it, but that's the status of it. People don't know much about it here. And in terms of Have like political like the government, though, I know that Japan has made some very positive moves towards denying visas for the military backed personnel for the Myanmar embassy and Tokyo. But at the same time, they are continuing to provide scholarships, government scholarships to people. And I guess that's the tricky part there. Because if you are in the government at the moment, right now, you're probably not taking part in the CDM. Therefore, you could possibly be pro military and to allow for the Japanese government to give these to these students might actually be very dangerous for the communities who are here in Japan already, we're very deeply involved in supporting the people's causes in back home. So that's a, you know, something that everybody has to be careful of, not just in my university, but in universities all over Japan, because we don't know who people are. And we know for a fact that most of the scholarships for Japan are actually government scholarships. So we know that most of the people who are awry who right here, especially in this period, in this cool period, are people who either have, you know, been taking part in the CDN, but narrowly escaped, or people who are not taking part in the CDN, but the government, not the government, sorry, the military have basically given them permission to leave the country. So this is a very difficult, feel difficult thing to navigate, because you cannot just go straight up to a person and ask are you pro military or not? Right? So that's something that a lot of the people here have to be careful of. I'm very careful about that. In my context, as well, I don't really know which student is which. So I tried to stay quiet. But I'm not very quiet online. The I recently had an a chat with one of the people from the Ministry of Justice in Japan. And he was very confused about CDM. And why the military is hunting down people who are involved in the CDM. And when I told him about all these horror stories, he said that he wanted to see news articles. And I sent him these news articles, which were written in English, of course, and he found it very difficult to translate into Japanese, but he did. But he sent me a message telling me that it's really difficult for him to imagine what's happening is that this level of cruelty, because this is not where they're, where they're from. It made me really upset because Burmese people are not used to this either. A lot of the people who are born in the past decades, were not born in these situations. Of course, people in the mountains, people who were in these conflict zones have always been in this situation, but people who are lived in the big cities, were not used to these situations, either. We're not used to this cruelty either. And there's just this a lot of disparity of information between the government and what's happening in Burma. And I think there's a huge need for us to raise awareness of these issues. I think I covered all of that today.
Host 1:33:23
No, that's a great, that's a great and comprehensive answer. And I'm really saddened to hear about your interaction, for a number of reasons. One, that he's not informed, obviously, but two is that someone in his position of his background should be more informed than most because of course, many people credit the top it off for its current nature and state of fascism as learning from the Japanese Imperial Army in World War Two, that this, the top dog was given birth by some of their training techniques. And so there is some culpability there there. This is the same organization that in their worst and dark years when they faced their own terror in their country that expanded around the world that there is some culpability. So that's, that's, that's distressing to hear.
May 1:34:14
It was a very tiring to say the least tiring talk because the amount of disbelief in the situation that was happening, his disbelief was not directed towards me, but the whole situation, but it was tiring, nevertheless, mentally draining to explain to people who are not able to accept that this is the reason why we're fighting that this is the reason why we're ready to sacrifice a lot of our selves, because there's just no way around it.
Host 1:34:51
Right, right. And I know that since World War Two and because of World War Two, Japan has been active in aid projects in Burma they have jika, which is the equivalent of like USAID, where they do a number of developmental projects in the country. And, of course, the real big news that came out of Japan in relation to Burma was when they closed the Kirin beer factory early on that that was quite a huge massive investment that they, they shut down. And that was a decision that was applauded. But going back to the first thing you said, you know, it's really distressing to hear that this kind of paranoia and fear that is raining in Myanmar, is also something that's being exported all the way across to Japan, that because there's these students coming on these visas, that you don't know their background, and you can't find out the background, that it is causing a sense of mistrust and self censorship and anxiety in terms of who one talks to and what they talk about. And to clarify, it might not be so much that you're in danger where you are there, but your family and friends and contacts in the country are certain would certainly be at great risk if you spoke to the wrong person about the wrong topic. And so the fact that this is happening, and even though as you mentioned, you could go outside for a walk at 11pm, you can go to the supermarket, there's 20 Different kinds of rice, you're living in this physical place of safety. This mental space of anxiety and fear that has been born and thrived in Myanmar for so many decades, is something that to some extent is following you. So that's following people like you. So that's really disheartening to hear.
May 1:36:36
It is, like think a lot of us who are now in Japan are you know, we're scared, not scared. We're very concerned. When the time comes for us to extend our passports. Are they going to do background checks on us? Are they going to be able to find out who we are and what we've been doing? Because we are not very sure the weather the Myanmar Embassy in Tokyo is actually with the people. We don't think they are, by the way, so that's a constant fear for us. We have all we all have Burmese passports right? So how are we going to continue with that? So far it's been okay have been updated by my friends that they've recently renewed their passports and everything is fine. Nobody has said anything to them. And the process is the same as before. So I'm keeping my fingers crossed until my time comes for my passport to be renewed. And then we'll you know hopefully by that time the all the turmoil in the country will be over but maybe in won't be yet also. Yeah.
Host 1:37:48
Well, thank you for that and thank you for everything else you've shared on here will include all the links when this goes out of your organization and certainly if people want to get their own portraits done that they they will know how to do that through you as well and and it's been great just learning about your background and what you're doing as an artist and your voice in the form of all these stories and poems and anecdotes and letters well continue to animate our podcast episodes going forward and thanks so much for joining us and sharing it this time.
May 1:38:23
Thank you very much for having me thank you
Ko Aye Win 1:38:48
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May 1:41:06
hair salon recently finished an internship after having graduated in Yangon. He was interviewed on April 17. In Kitchen state. I had already experienced something similar in the past. So I knew this was happening for real. I felt hopeless. I felt destroyed. I felt as if my future has been stolen from when the coup happened. I was staying with my school seniors in Lyon township Yongle. One of them was going to attend his first day at work. And while he was getting ready, the leader of his organization called him and informed him about the coup. That's how we found out that the military had seized power and cut all networks. I had already experienced something similar in the past. So I knew this was happening for real. I felt hopeless. I felt destroyed. I felt as if my future had been stolen from me. Just before the coup, I had gotten a job in Yangon, and was planning to gain more work experience in preparation for my studies abroad. But I Knew this wouldn't be possible under a military regime. So I decided to go back to Christian sect. Most of my school comrades choose to stay and participate in the protest movement in Yangon. But honestly, I had no intention of doing that. I was certain that the military would do anything to stop the protests. I know this military gender, and I know that they're capable of committing the worst atrocities. In 2011. They shot a friend of mine and a relative. And I didn't want to live through anything like that, again. We the kitchen people have been bullied since we were born, never receiving any support from the central government, and even less so from the military. When the ceasefire between the kg AIA and the Myanmar military collapsed, I was in grade nine. On June 22 2011, the military came to our village. It was a devastating experience. We had to flee and stay in the jungle on the Chinese border for days. In the end, this place became a camp for IDPs, including me and my family. The camp leaders managed to build a school with very few resources available, which is how I was able to carry on with my education. Most young people and adults were asked to join the key IA and so my father became a soldier. I lived with my mother, my younger brother and two sisters in the camp. My three other siblings stayed in Eugene now, in 2016, we had to flee again, because the military engaged in water shelling of an area nearby. Having fled Civil War twice in my life. I don't like the military chanter at all, to put it mildly. I think nonviolent works in some parts of the world, but it doesn't work in Myanmar. Now I'm staying in a new city state on the Chinese border called Liza, where the headquarters is the key IO are. The city is in a valley and you only need to cross the river to get into the Chinese territory. Everything you need can be found in lizer hotels, restaurants, shops, schools, providing free education and hospitals providing free health care. You can use both Myanmar chats and Chinese you want here. It's a safe place. There's no CDM in this area. Many Syrian people from the rest of the country are coming to find refuge here, or to join basic military training. I heard most of the training is given in permies. There are also many young kitchen people coming to Liza some deserve the KP ICT. My personal hope for the future is still to study abroad. But it has been a real struggle, and I am tired of trying. Right now I need to help my people. If I need to engage in combat, I will, I can avoid it. Many kitchens have become actively involved in the key I O or its army. Having an independent state is the dream of kitchen people. And I wish to be a part of the generation that will see this dream come true. We need to stand for what we believe in. We have that responsibility. I knew there will be many challenges on this journey to freedom. But we will fight until we achieve independence. I believe that the key I O will be one of the leaders of the real political change and Nima speaking to the international community. I would like to ask them to recognize Myanmar's he arose and the systems of governance they have established their respective states and regions, including the education systems. I wish the world would cooperate with the EA O's since Myanmar's ethnic people see them as their legitimate governments. In reality, these EA O's represent the voice of ethnic people. At any moment
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Host 1:51:50
Hey Alex, thanks so much for joining us here to have a little conversation about your background in Myanmar.
Alex 1:51:55
Hey, thank you for having me.
Host 1:51:59
Yeah, so before we get into a little bit of what you've been doing this month, can you tell us a bit about your experiences in traveling to Myanmar? When was that and what brought you there
Alex 1:52:10
I was lucky enough to go on two separate occasions to visit Myanmar. The first was in 2012 I think or maybe the beginning of 2015 and it was a it was a friend that I was going to travel with that that convinced me to to go there I didn't really know too much about the country I think I was aware of the resolution that they had in 2008 So yeah, I didn't they didn't have I didn't know what to expect. And I can remember I was reading a lot about going there and I think it was as far as I remember it was putting recent deduction up to tourists or definitely Australian tourists so it wasn't like a lot of information and they said there was all these special requirements to have so certain amount of US dollar bills that are in perfect condition trading and yet a lot of strange things and I wasn't I wasn't sure what to expect on first first arrival I was just like I was I was I was amazed by Yangon how vibrant and and also peaceful it was they had a everyone was just on bicycles and motorbikes or cars really because just like a lot of a lot going on. I was amazed at how like warm and friendly everyone was saying hello to me on the street and see what's going on. This is amazing. And I did sort of a excellent way to the tourist main tourist destinations that was to Mandalay visited Saigon. In my life yeah. I didn't go on the coasts the first time. And yeah, it was a really really special place in my diet. I was I felt I felt really privileged to, to see and to see that that period of time. After grinding a bad man, pretty brutal history that they have Have the bug free previous was moment when it was it was open. It was I got a crash course history when I was there.
Host 1:55:14
Right and that first trip must have made some kind of impression on you because you decided to go again. So what was it about that first trip that really stuck with you? And then what shape did your second journey take?
Alex 1:55:26
By the second game? It was a shorter one. And it was my plan friends is my my girlfriend at the time. The father had a program where he was building toilets. And in the lint areas. My memory right now are these brick, brick toilets. They were like with a pig. And as far as I understood, that was like, kind of what the area is. I guess they didn't have so we did a we organized a big fundraiser. Back in Sydney. We had like some party capacity and for everyone to chip in and we raised a bunch of money was that to build things like eight or nine toilets? I didn't I didn't do the building like they paid some people to they paid paid local people. And then we stayed we stayed at this this place it was it was owned by English expat and she had a school. It was like, after the kids school that the government school in place, they would go afterwards and I think it was mostly English. Yeah, English lesson. Volunteer teaches. So I went there and I painted a bunch of murals all around the school and he also was doing a dental hygiene program. So friends when I was traveling there with their pharmacy teachers in Australia, and they were doing classes on using toothbrushes. And that was again dental hygiene classes in English to their other classes.
Host 1:57:46
And so you were painting murals around the school and so then did you have a background as an artist and what kinds of scenes were you painting there?
Alex 1:57:57
I did I do quite a few ideas. They told me like all we need a we want to map on the on to the kids I drew a map of the world then I did one it was they have the head a sink. That was when they were going to be brushing their teeth. And I I drew like a diagram of four different sets of mouths with to fashion age like showing the rotation and the movements of how to do it written in English and then Burmese or lettering. And then I painted another section with a big like a bit of a sort of scene with some kids walking along and like a few different tools and things that I saw like some of the trees I saw and I remember that the kids with the dead always have the tree, the taste and the tree on their cheeks.
Host 1:59:12
Right Tameka?
Alex 1:59:13
Yeah, I picked them with that. And yeah
Host 1:59:25
yeah, so that's great. So you're bringing kinds of art and color into this area and giving some sounds like the first time you went, it was more of the typical backpackers trip of getting to see the culture especially right as it was opening up. So it was a pretty special time and then the next time you came back for with a sense of service and with giving back and and then you have those two trips to reflect upon and thinking about your time in Myanmar like what stands out with the culture, the people, is there something that drew you to the country and the culture in ways that You haven't been connected elsewhere and if so, what is that if you can put a word to it,
Alex 2:00:04
ah, there's so many things. The first would just be like, the warm people just just I don't know, I just I felt I felt like welcome and connected to these people I didn't even know. I was, I was there. I also really enjoyed that I enjoyed the food, I thought it was an interesting mix between for me it was like a mix of the entire US and Thai food, but you need I was going to tea houses and that back to all the coaches that I had around that. And variation of landscape, it's amazing, you know, relatively big country, but lucky producers had no hit a wide variety of landscapes. Like the lake may like The Rolling being there and the red sand is gone. And then the the coastal region there's so many things that that about, it just it was it was always a place that I would say like, like it like tell people like if you can get a chance to go there, like do it. It's awesome. It's so it's so special, you won't regret it. And I know a lot of people that didn't go there someone my recommendation some already wanting to go and they all get turned, having had like a wonderful experience.
Host 2:02:10
Right. So you have these really warm experiences and memories of being there. And of course, after the February 1 coup, it this is a terrible thing to happen to any country anywhere. But when you actually have this personal connection, it's all the more traumatic and real. And when you were dealing with your feelings and processing the pain of what was happening, you actually did something in your local community to represent and memorialize your connection to the country. So can you share a bit about what it was that you did?
Alex 2:02:47
Yeah, right. So yeah, I you described that you describe the feeling really well. Being on the other side of the world and, and seeing seeing the things that happen. And I guess my, I have the power of painting as my way to express myself, I use that I now living in Montreal, Canada. And after seeing and I, I decided like I'm gonna paint a mural of some sort to to bring bringing awareness to what's going on because there is a really popular mural, same here are in the PD, same city and a lot of a lot of the artworks do get shared around quite a lot. So I hope that that that it would get spread around.
Host 2:03:58
Right, so you made a mural based on some scenes and imagery of what was happening there can as this is a audio form, we can't show the beautiful imagery and the metaphors that you put there. I will definitely refer to it so people can look at after the interview. But can you do your best to describe what was actually in the mural that you created? Yeah, yeah.
Alex 2:04:21
Okay. So it was it was along with two other friends that assisted me. It's, it was actually a coincidence. It wasn't until we actually started that, that I managed that the colors and the way that I broke it up. It became to represent me and my flag. And like we have in the in the center with the green there's the eye I painted that gun just I that that landscape is just imprinted in my memory and I and I I created that that with these temples and then one of the temples i i turned the three finger salute that that I was seeing everyone do that. Turn that into stone. Stone Temple Yeah, so just give it this. Like the strength oh no idea people having to hope that people will prevail. And then in the sky we might one of my friends just like who's he never been there but the ones who came with him and helped me and he just he saw the texts. The script in the script is amazing. I want to I want to do something that sounds like Aha, okay. And we write it tight. Kyle sin.
Host 2:06:08
Right. Yeah. You're talking about the young girl in Mandalay? Who was killed?
Alex 2:06:13
Yeah, exactly. She had on the show, everything will be okay. And so we translated that into, into the domains. And and then we were like writing across in the sky. And got this resistor, the frames here it seems COVID happened that is San Saba DNLA, which is everything to be okay. That is being written everywhere, and with little rainbows all around them on shore. And I just saw this kind of connection with that. It's a, it's a, I think I wrote in my description that it felt like kind of long and ironic to write. But it also it's helpful to we have that written in gold across the sky. And then in the font, we have the section of the flags read, I have some just just some imagery from the people. There's some people protesting doing the salute. I saw the shields that everyone had made, and they'd written people on it instead of police. I just thought that was really creating. And and then yeah. And that was my my friend Omar, who also helped me he did the portrait of tylosin. Photographs. I mean, we paint we painted it quite early on to I think I think that that just just happened maybe like a few days before. And it took us a little while to process it. And it wasn't the situation's it's gotten worse.
Host 2:08:26
Right. Yeah, it certainly has and you, you do have like a mixture of hope and terror. And perhaps optimism all mixed in there. I mean, you have the as you mentioned, the landscape, this aerial landscape of bygone which looks like any picture or if you've been too big on it's very reminiscent of this three this along with the pagodas is this, this three finger salute rising with that, but that's in the background in the foreground, you have, you know, tear gas and riot police and then off to the right, you have Angel, this young woman who was killed and early on in Mandalay. And so there there is this kind of mix of all these different things going on at the same time, which is probably pretty authentic to how it feels there in the ground.
Alex 2:09:16
Yeah, yeah. I think I like what you just described. There is this I thought the front was was the presence and the the the center would be the is the past and the history of the people. And when the top layer was this hope for the future.
Host 2:09:48
Right and you do have a series of Red Balloons going off into the distance. What does that represent?
Alex 2:09:56
The red balloons I I chose to paint because because I saw some I think it was a demonstration or something of a way of passing passing messages I quite kind of convert to lead by some of the protesters where they were then pushing balloons out of the truck. And the red was to represent the unsung zucchinis party. It is it does make a compositional element because there's this smoke kind of coming the same angle as as the balloons. But that also, I guess, balloons, they kind of free you set them off into the sky. And there's a freedom to I think I painted them with the intention of giving them like this like part of freedom, like guiding them and then entering the section of the site.
Host 2:11:00
Right. And then, of course, you have all these scenes that are more like kind of environmental and atmosphere. But then you have this one person who is actually or actually was a real person who was killed. But that's to me, it was like this contrast of like this real individual that's humanized with this backdrop of landscape and scenery. And she is where at least for me, the AI really falls on someone that is recognizable and is is is identifiable as you know who she is. And, you know, her story is really tragic. As much the news coming out this particular story seemed to hit people in a much more powerful way. This was a young woman in Mandalay, who was I don't remember her age, maybe about 20 years old. And there's pictures of her father tying a bit of red on her her arm before she goes out to protest for luck and to keep one safe. And when the police assault started, there was tear gas and water cannons. And there's pictures of all of this she's defending herself. She's she's getting down with the other protesters, and a sniper shot to the head took her out. And there's pictures just minutes before she's another protesters are hunkering to the ground trying to protect themselves in this non violent protest. So as the police force is coming and approaching these non violent protesters, it's getting more and more chaotic with the tear gas and the combination of rubber bullets and live bullets. And as she is hunkering down and there's pictures of her, she is taken out by a shot to the head from a sniper. And so this whole scene of this young girl going to a non violent protests and what she's wearing, what she looks like how she's protecting herself, and her death. Tragically, this is all recorded and seen by all and it's just terribly horribly tragic. She, they Empty your pockets, and they find that one of the few things she's carrying is a piece of paper, identifying her blood type, and asking that her blood and organs be preserved so that other protesters can if she's beyond saving, which she was that she selflessly can give of herself and body so that others may live and continue this cry for freedom and democracy. And her there, there have been over 800 deaths by the time we're recording this there were she was one of the first few but even among those few, her death took on a kind of significance unparalleled to the others that we're seeing. I'm not sure exactly what it was. I think it was a combination of the extraordinary courage and selflessness and drive to want to bring this freedom to her country. And this sense of life and energy that even in just pictures of her you just you see her inhabiting and of course the shirt which said everything will be okay. And this taken on some kind of symbolism. And the military also saw this because the day after her funeral, they broke into her grave and they stole her corpse and filled it with cement and it's now missing as they continue this bizarre practice of stealing corpses or taking dead bodies and not giving them back and no one really knows exactly what they're doing with that. It's been surmised that in angels case it was a fear that she would become a martyr and somehow taking the corpse away in their estimation, would prevent this martyrdom on on the part of protesters. And they also went to this absurd length of providing an investigation that categorically the military did not kill her, that it was a fellow protester, which, you know, of course, no one believes and would be, would be laughable if it wasn't so tragic. But in any case, what so that's the background of who she is for listeners that don't know, what I wanted to ask you is your first your personal feelings and when you heard her story, and when you got this news about what had happened to her how that personally impacted us specifically, and then why it impacted you. To the extent it did that this becomes like the real, live vibrant feature of this whole mural depicted through her. Yeah, I
Alex 2:15:53
guess, I guess, as you mentioned, it was one of the very first deaths of somebody and there's photographs of moments before that there was one picture in particular, where she's at home, she's handing a bottle of water for somebody. And it was just as as as an artist looking at a figure of a person standing there it looks so courageous and powerful. And like I think it was even the images that like I saw I really like this like this person is what is the significance of this person and what's happened No, I didn't paint the portrait of her and that was my friend Omar. And so I can't speak on on on on it as much as I'm sure he could because we spent I think it was maybe three of his other countries over three or four days painting a painting and coming back and he just wasn't happy with the portrait in the face and things saying like I need to get it I need to get it right and I need to do a justice but like, you know, this is bizarre. I didn't know about the cement cement thing but you know, maybe maybe there is putting a central figure as almost like a like a like a motto chosen as a as a representative of the court I think that's what I felt that's what she represented at this stage when I was first seeing all the images on the
Host 2:18:12
right and looking at this overall mural you did and painting this very Myanmar seen even going to the lengths to translate everything will be okay through as you mentioned on your posts through Google Translate and you did get it right alone simmba body I think is how it how it comes to and and bringing this real Burmese business to Montreal, what reception Have you found both locally and globally to the work
Alex 2:18:44
as I mentioned earlier that there's there's a lot of people that do photograph straight up around the city, so it's been reposted by I think all of the a lot of a lot of different photographers combined. Posted we posted pictures of it it's sadly because of the situation I feel Tata to this the situation of COVID and isolation most of the interactions I've had were online I've seen some comments and and interactions with the post from from people that are following the situation. Yeah. So I hope that I hope that it gives a gives a global picture of the people that around the world that that that care and are upset about what's happening, they're not
Host 2:19:58
and one of the things that is I appreciated about it was that you were really doing something in your own environment, what? Whatever your own background was and your own skills and within the limits of what it was possible for you to do. You were expressing something to show solidarity and support. And I think that there is a feeling outside of Myanmar by those who have been affected by the country and the people in some way. That, oh, this is so terrible, what's happening and some kind of feeling of helplessness or sometimes a feeling of guilt. survivor's guilt, that one can be very connected to the people and culture but is safe and is free, unlike them. And I think that these feelings are natural of having some helplessness or guilt, especially in the early stages. I know that I definitely did. But I think as time passes, there is a way to look at well, what can I do, I am here and there are limitations. But within my skill set within my ability, what is it that I can do, to speak on or support the situation. And this is one of the reasons why I want to talk to you and one of the things that I was, I was inspired by is that you have used your skill in painting and social media and social consciousness to be able to bring this issue to a wider audience, and not just informed people in Canada, or people interested in art and street art around the world. But also, back in Myanmar, people that are going through a really difficult time are able to see a visual representation of something that was not easy to make that took time and planning and care, and really see the moral support that is being given to them and their hour of need. And that can't be underestimated. So that is something that I just wanted to highlight, as a reminder for all of us that wherever we are, whatever we're doing whatever our capacity or our limitations, there is a role that we can play now. And this is a ongoing story whose chapter is not done. And all of these little things matter, every little thing that people do, in some way is contributing to the momentum on the side of the protesters. And this is a beautiful reminder of that. So I also wanted to ask you in your motivation and thought process and doing in wanting to create this heart, what was going through your mind as to why you wanted to undertake this and why you felt some kind of obligation or sense of purpose in creating this
Alex 2:22:42
wow, yeah, I mean, I imagine it's maybe it's a similar feeling that you probably have making making contacts. And using your, your skills, which you do very well in explaining the situation and, and, and talking to people about it. I think like this is this is the one this is something I'm I have a skill set and it can be used to convey messages and convey important things and in a, in a interesting way that people want to interact with and pay close attention. So it's, it's a, it's an honor to be able to use my skills in that capacity. And and it's, it's, it's, it's, well for me, it's the most fulfilling, most fulfilling thing like I can I can I can make, and painting can be can be quite a selfish endeavor that you do you do alone, but when it has, when I make things that have a real word world connection, I think it's the best way to use my spiel.
Host 2:24:22
Yeah, certainly. Well, thank you so much for taking the time to be here and share your story and most importantly, to make this artwork and may more and more people see this and may this serve this artwork as well as the conversation we're having serve as an inspiration for others to similarly think about what gifts they have to the world and what they can do at this time to support the Burmese people.
Alex 2:24:47
Thank you so much having me and I really, really admire what you're doing and podcasting and I would appreciate it. Thank you
2:25:19
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Host 2:27:27
Thank you for taking the time to listen to this show. I understand that this is an enormously difficult time for many people these days, myself included. And just the mere fact of staying informed is helping to keep a focus on this pertinent issue. And the only way that we can do our job of continuing to provide this content at this very critical time is through the support of generous donors, listeners like yourselves. So if you found this episode of value and would like to see more shows like this on the current crisis, please consider making a donation to support our efforts. Either monthly pledges or one time donations are fully appreciated. And all funds go immediately to the production of more episodes like this one. Thank you deeply in advance and best wishes at this time. If you would like to join in our mission to support those in Myanmar who are resisting the military coup, we welcome your contribution in any form, currency or transfer method. Every cent goes immediately and directly to funding those local communities who need it most. donations go to support such causes as a civil disobedience movement CDM families of deceased victims, and the purchasing of protective equipment and medical supplies. Or if you prefer, you can earmark your donation to go directly to the guests you just heard on today's show. In order to facilitate this donation work, we have registered a new nonprofit called Better Burma for this express purpose. Any donation you give on our insight Myanmar website is now directed to this fund. Alternatively, you can visit our new better Burma website, which is better Burma one word.org and donate directly there. In either case, your donation goes to the same cars and both websites accept credit cards. You can also give via PayPal by going to paypal.me/better Burma. Additionally, we can take donations through Patreon Venmo GoFundMe and Cash App. Simply search better Burma on each platform and you'll find our account. You can also visit either website for specific links to those respective accounts, or email us at info at better burma.org. In all cases, that's better Burma. One word spelled b e t t e r b u r Ma. If you would like to give it another way, please contact us. Thank you so much for your kind consideration. Well heroes mega strong well welcome all those wave wave