Transcript: Episode #57: Act with Courage, Pray with Faith
Following is the full transcript for the interview with Doh Say, which appeared on June 9, 2021. This transcript was made possible by Artificial Intelligence (AI) and has not been checked by any human reader. Because of this, many of the words may not be accurate in this text. This is particularly true of speakers who have a stronger accent, as AI will make more mistakes interpreting and transcribing their words. For that reason, this transcript should not be cited in any article or document without checking the timestamp to confirm the exact words that the guest has really said.
Host 00:00
hear some sounds of the jungle here in current state. I'm really excited to bring you the upcoming interview with a very special guest. You'll hear him discussing all the great and courageous work that he's currently engaged in. And if you feel inspired to help him continue these efforts, please consider making a donation earmarked for his projects, or feel free to give a general donation that will support the wider movement in Myanmar. Our ongoing support is so helpful and appreciated by the Burmese people during these dark days. Simply go to Insight myanmar.org slash donation to contribute today. or stay tuned to the end of the episode to hear more options. Now, let's hear from that guest himself. There's a sounds of insects, small bird and a strain in the back.
David Eubank 02:22
This is Susan Eubank, and I'm going to be reading those brilliant eyes, which I wrote on a mission in Burma where I am at right now. Those brilliant eyes they shine so bright while smiling or in a gunfight. They show the pain of loss terrain, they fought so desperately for a land they owned, for years unknown was stripped and ripped from their hands. And yet those eyes still see the light of freedom yet untold. They fight for lives have gone and yet to come. Those brilliant eyes reveal the wisdom earned from yours in battle. Though his heart was never turned. Those eyes shine bright and full of light. With a slight glimpse of charm, still known will hold his grandchild just for a wild and tell him stories of old and when they ask why he doesn't have a second hand to hold. Those eyes will show a love and told and a price he had to pay to hold his child and tell him Oh how I love you so day. Hey, by the way, have a good day.
Host 04:31
Okay, I'm very pleased today to be speaking with dos a DOS say welcome to joining us on inside me and my podcast.
Doh Say 04:40
Yes, thank you.
Host 04:41
Yeah. So can you tell me where we're talking to you from where are you located now?
Doh Say 04:46
And Cabo Cabo I did district in northern Korean state.
Host 04:52
Yes. And I should I should say, Please don't answer any question that exposes you to any risk. So If you if you are not able to answer a question in detail, that's fine, just only answer as far as you're safe.
Doh Say 05:08
Okay,
Host 05:09
so can you tell me a bit? As far as you're comfortable and as it's safe? Can you tell me a bit about the camp that you're located and what's happening there?
Doh Say 05:21
Ken, here, we about as much there was as Triton on placecard de buno. So, Ken is known so far for like two hours walking. So we are from the north shore and they will know.
Host 05:42
Right, and can you tell us a bit about your camp? What what are you doing at the camp? What are the activities, they're
Doh Say 05:50
here, we tried many the ethnic people from different groups, cranny chain shala hupo. So, we call them and they want to be to be able to do something for their country for the organizations. So, every year from this training camp, so many the different ethnic groups and team members here to be trained. So firstly, we tell them about God. And because this is very important for all hours, this word freedom, freedom arranger belief, because without God without, we get lost, we may be able to do many things with our love. Many, many problems just lie now what is happening in Burma many, now leaders in Burma, now they are very skillful, because of the problem we are facing because they have love for the people. So when the young people they come here, so we tell them to love God and love each other and to forgive each other. So, we told them we comprise our CIO, cio and body so we need to also attend them they are so and the same town so he made their body strong so they can do it they can do things when they go back to their respective area.
Host 07:29
Right so is it mainly Christian groups and Christian participants that are coming that you're training on? No, no, no
Doh Say 07:37
ma'am. Most of them are non believers. So yeah, there is just a sample so Christians, so they are non believers. We told them we asked Okay, you got one that you have is okay. We go we don't say we don't we don't say we we are we welcome to everyone here every religions every races.
Host 08:08
Right. Right. And can you share a bit about what kind of training you give you mentioned the the spiritual lessons that you'd like to share, but what about the the physical lessons and the the actual training that the participants will learn with you?
Doh Say 08:25
Yeah. So the scale we provide them so there are many so mostly the survivors gay and so confidence gay that will count against them fine standard here, when the beginning they arrived, so, we asked them to not carry those fly round trip three hours before even like two days. Now, because we have some other places that road aspects. So is coming closer to carry supplies from the shop to our camp, but this lies at the beginning. So they come to me they start with to me the to me the body becomes strong. And then later after the first week, they will Esther nanny especially those who cannot see them so we teach them how to send in the beginning like two weeks constant every day. And also how to do row bridge to climb row row climbing, rappelling, puncher, pincher and later Later, the second week sibility so we teach them about how to do recording video with digital camera and interview. So how do you do that effective interview and recording very basics. We call it shallow, very basics and easy to remember. And also basis medical first aid And GPS land navigation and leadership. Yes, yes. Good. Like, that
Host 10:08
sounds incredible. How long are these courses?
Doh Say 10:10
Yeah, altogether, we ought to get a three months here, when they arrive. So, two weeks, two weeks before the training studies, oh, we already asked them to carry things. So, in two weeks, so, when ready, we started so, the training time is a two and a half weeks. So, after that, we went on the practical mission. So wherever there's a need, so, pleasure, we hear we hear Okay, now, this play that plays under attack by an virmani. So, we go to the place where all these newly graduated team members and so on the on the on the frontline we we leave them and teach them how to do things. So, how to do how to provide security for yourself for the people and how to provide content. So, especially the good like club, because many people live in fear, but when you are there we are there we are organising the program called good live club, these are for mainly for the kids program, but is also apply for anyone who parents will come. So, when it depends on what time how much time you have, sometimes we may end up play in their hideouts the whole day. So, we do one day program. So sometimes when we have only half day because they have to go back or shrunk. They come from any different hideouts so and that programs I look at because all the time they are living in fear afraid of Romagna tagging worry about this and by joining the program, they really you know you look everyone cares not only kids and parents and our leaders around they're all loving come home and they forget all their problems. So that me program there are many dramas sprasia Drama, haircare drama, so educate them know how to keep the environment key, how to take out that body. So like ladies, and sound games, we call it Junior Ranger. So TJ, like some of the middle school, high school students, all the things that the Ranger learn from the training here they are transformed to summer escape to the middle school high school students. So that is all together where we four months depends on the situation. If the situation say the Romani lounger major offenses in many places. So we say is that okay? Now we say we cannot go back, we say stay with all these villagers. So we need to do something for them. But usually there's nothing happens after one trip, maybe three weeks trip, then they can't go back to all their mother
Host 12:56
organization. So you're not just teaching them practical skills, which are valuable enough. But you're also creating this sense of community among incredible diversity of the different ethnics that are coming in the different religions that are coming. You're creating the sense of togetherness of community of interconnectedness, and you're also helping them to in the face of this kind of terror they're facing from the Burma army, to have some inner value and inner strength in going through life with what they're facing. So that all sounds really great. How long have these trainings been going on?
Doh Say 13:37
trainees like, first year beginner is three months. And so and then next year, they can come back. And we call it advents. So and more, more, more, more things, and more techni from order a price and the first year they are learning about security, because when they are in on a mission during the mission, the frontline, they are to provide security for themselves for the team members is as a villages around and therefore the villagers. So when they come that second year, they will learn more about the security. So the same day, the last day in the beginning, they were learning land navigation, but when they come back, they will learn more about the how to how to make draw better maths. And I'll do do better land invocation Sunday like that.
Host 14:37
Right and forth. Since when did he have these courses started? How many years they've been going on?
Doh Say 14:43
Are they studying said two dogs and two dogs and two dogs. So if I remember,
Host 14:49
so about about 20 years more than 20 years?
Doh Say 14:52
Yes.
Host 14:52
Right and you're a trainer on these courses. So how did you come to be a trainer? How did you come to learn these things? And then teachers these skills yourself,
Doh Say 15:02
were for my c'est la vie da ba, David's so many instructors also the land for sure in the beginning, only a few instructors. So we all learn from him. And as he teaching, I mainly have an introvert so at the same time though I learned so before he organizes the group, a small group training for the instructors, and then later so all these shoeing instructors can help him teach these in the beginning. We study lay that into the exam.
Host 15:40
Right, right. So you've you've learned from David Eubanks of the free Burma Rangers you're referring to? Can you tell us a bit about where you met them and how your relationship goes back with David.
Doh Say 15:51
I met him in 97 first time that di was no was no freedom arranger yet I was working with another polityka group so that I met him so since then, every year I have more content with him and Layla I have I go with him on a mission like once a year so I began to know him better and so also as a goal with him on the trip alone many good things for him especially he increased my spiritual strength long before I was the kind of like like call myself a traditional Christian I was crazy my parents were Christian but I just this all because my parents were Christian and Christian. So when we were young, we were in we went to Sunday school teachers Okay, now you are our age you are Trejo should teach you should be baptized so we just do these only by I don't really know God and Jesus and day for many years so when I first time many 97 and that time so we started working we he used to drive to the refugee camps for many many times so I was weighing him as he driving so he was telling us all about Jesus and he's telling us about his his three days later and also Plus he bring in many also his friends who also the same thing sharing many very strong fee so then I go there say Who are you You are nothing and you have only a little bit education and you are very no escape escape even you don't have money this and why you don't why you don't prioritize golf I look at all those key radio very educated, very smart, they all graduate and have money has this and try to stay average. It's more than that dude, they say stay prioritize God. So tell me what are they doing? Number one is they say God, thank you, God, please be with us like that. And then I slowly slowly increase in my spiritual strength to daily bank and many his friends he takes people with him. To me.
Host 18:22
That's really interesting. So in what ways would you describe that your spiritual faith and your Christian practice has been strengthened through your relationship with David
Doh Say 18:34
just like the manifester we say we believe in God but at the same time, we are afraid to do this that this for you know for myself where God asked God to do is we have to do sometime maybe dangerous sometime maybe difficult. someday maybe easy. Human Nature is that way easy. Almost everybody can do but when difficult things or very dangerous things and then how nobody wants to do so I was in after media here for many years. So many trips to go along to Kearney even with a debate group, but I will stay afraid. So I went out free so I remember God because so he taught us for many years when you're afraid you you pray to god you ask love and then go the power or to wherever you want to go. And so it is I tried this and when he told me and so in many many years many trips I I did like this so I managed to go even sometimes, especially I'm alone. I have to go on mission one person only. Very dangerous, very lonely and very tough on the mountain. Yes. My bed peg is so Sunday I don't want to go and we call mainly I was ASHRAE also that I was my fitness is not so good. So carry all the supplies and you know me for the teachers for the offense to the area that I pray and I go and it's Thursday and I managed to claim all these big mountains and close to all these difficulties are dangerous and landmines. So these are how I mentioned my spiritual and also many places are even easy but we are because oh no, I I may I don't want to leave my families or because a rainy oh no Marie Oh, there's so many leeches so many like I don't want to go again. So I said go now Please help me. So I then I can start forgetting all these problems and just go
Host 20:45
Oh, that's great. Can you give me one example of a mission that you took that was difficult and that was dangerous, and how your faith in that specific mission how that helped you get through what was a very difficult and dangerous operation through your your faith and your belief.
Doh Say 21:08
There are many, many is a many 20 years I can't remember or maybe has tried to say some of the trips I remember. So as the group I remember in 2004 planning there's a tsunami tsunami happened that year. So we were in the northern northern current state and so then currently so we were with a big group or many freedom arranger members there we here because that time brahma nilanjan is a major offenses against all those area with three major colons so many many villages five villages from Northern currency and five villages from Southern cranny so they all fled to the same spot. So we hear that I went so when we know that we're very close, so we are afraid so I don't know some paper and a plus also the reason one of the reasons I worry more is sometimes oh we don't know where's the landmines not only talking about you know, facing brahmani but also get to worry about am I laying by the crane or trainee because I know I have many experiences Some are the crane or cranny step on their own EMI and that makes me very worried so and also because that time I told you I was no not so fit so i i always slow and leave behind and there are many team members they already go ahead so when I will leave behind me I'm very slow so in some urgency I Oh which which way should I go left or right or straight? Then I start worrying because I chose the wrong way then maybe it is a lien Li leading leading me to the Romani or maybe leading to the weather current name their minds for things like that so very angry very worried very afraid. And nighttime you know they're sometimes very close cannot sleep very well. So because they're afraid so I just mainly I pray nine here and then like one I was looking around because the before night the daytime many villagers arriving we already received like I don't know many that time seven village villages. So and then like when we arrived there more villagers come in so I look at all their faces. I look at their eyes, know full of fears and full paska in their bed in a bag. In a boat hands holding their son daughter babies and stay in the end the mother Chester care one baby will look at the man they're carrying on for supplies for their family. And they look at their faces I I look at this that Oh no. Someday I don't feel like I don't feel like good. And then I was looking around. So when they're asleep so because of the winter. So very cool in northern northern currency. And so I look around about line of midnight. So many of you that do not have enough blank Erica when they leave, they don't manage to bring everything they only draw with them to all the essential things like maybe rice or machete, maybe one blanket for the whole family. But area is also many dry firewood. But if you are afraid on making fire because it may fire you around you for a long distance they can see the flame so they can share or they can so for that there is in the room a fire even very close. They just take the call the whole night. So I will look at all go from you know family to family because they are sleeping on the ground so on the on the leaves so I go around I check so I start coming out oh I was that I was working with the political group I was fighting against the bone on me politically also here many different angles are fighting against with them militarily and also international community doing the you know diplomatic analysis session embargo etc. So but even though all these day these things that happen when you stay strong and can stay managed to come to all these mountainous area and give prominence to all these innocent villages, so I thought I feel like very helpless so and then the first time when it's more here on the tours more here then I thought God please attaches the house provided me so that they can go there and leave all the villages alone then I came Yeah. So I came down from that that was 224 so the first I know I pray for the my enemy
Host 26:15
that was the first time you prayed for your enemy and what was the what happened after your prayer.
Doh Say 26:21
So then later we have to leave so in other places because during when the villagers have to run away from the you know enemies, so many unnecessary problems as they happen so in one village I remember and that the mountain they had to climb very very high and so the one that we Essaouira and stay with them so they feel very good in the morning we had to leave so there is another spot so we show that we have to go because the days are also another group were there we had to go and check on them many villagers especially like 80 years old grandmother begging us to please don't leave last day she was telling that last night us saying without Wi Fi very very wrong to me they said so please don't stay keep staying with us. You don't need to worry about food you eat the food we were told we have provided food to us like that she was like to buy we told them we were no sorry we have to go to another place and then there's some other young so okay is that you cannot stay with us what about you leave some soldiers with us? I told that we also we do not have soda because Dan Kennedy's cutie soda with us so that we don't have to then say what about extra weapon and give it to us now we know that we're sorry we don't have extra weapons even Can you can you candidate do not have the extra weapons. So a difficult very difficult to make a decision but we said sorry. So we had to go and now we pray with Anna we love to for another Idv hideouts, so says the I look at I know get up to now the situation is improving, improving me. So after that, we go back to the battalions regime and their headquarters. And then two weeks later villager can return to their villages. So that was it before. So I was just in crania across northern currency last summer, so that in January, yeah, January. So every day, everyone pledges in their villages. Right? So say, we pray for them. That's what I did these days. My own my view, I pray. And I believe so many people pray so that villagers can save on the now the present situation.
Host 29:04
I see. So this is an example of the power of prayer. And you're talking about the first time that you actually prayed for your enemies and your pray for your enemies not to cause harm. And that you you also mentioned that part of your faith is a faith and a belief in love and sharing the power of love and filling yourself with love and sharing that with those in the community. And yet, you're living in a region where the Burmese military is causing unspeakable terrible evil and harm among all the peoples and communities that you're living with. And so how has the challenge Ben for you to maintain that faith maintain that belief in love that belief in prayer and forgiveness in spite of the evils that you're directly facing and encountering?
Doh Say 29:58
For me, I just need to pray for every day I also asked my leader my friends, my family to pray for even including my son I asked him to pray for me because we cows now we are very good maybe in five minutes we can also very bad. So guys, I know I started a strange idea frame more than a frail Roman army you can fight but there's something that you don't know because you can very securely without realizing you're a big mistake. So, these big enemy freedom can come to you. So, these are made change when we do the physical fitness So, you have to do like everyday to maintain all the spiritual strength to get more loves to get more faith in God you have to do every day no two times a day not three times a day. So so the first thing I get up I read my Bible and pray and I just go do something and then before I go to bed I pray so the same guys are listening some of the you know our species creatures from the internet and also here if and also other people sharing so seeing all the prominent periods of survey on the ground that also increase my my somebody my understanding he got because I thought I thought I have no idea and I thought oh very god you know learned this and were on the ground you see many people serve and I really I realize I need to be a humble myself I need to be very thankful that God gave me many things. And also the surfing more than I have. Also the event man they are these brilliant they give you a big smile when they arrive in the hideouts or their villages they're very happy. Same time as a man you are with free time you are working alone because I'm walking alone has lied to you before many many times to crannies are sometimes very afraid and die very lonely. But certainly I see once I see one villager China. Oh, she very encouraged that that was even I don't know he so someday you see only your friend one of your team member your friend suddenly. Oh yeah, I see very good. So the same thing I was when they are very afraid. Villages afraid where we arrived. So they are very, very happy. So and I say okay, now they so my you and they are encouraged us, me and me to to come to all these certificate dangerous places. Because that damn moment you don't you don't think about all the danger or the dangers because when you see all the smiling, they are happy because you're present there. Yeah, this is how I increase my strength to stay new to do a lot.
Host 33:14
So you mentioned before that when you encounter people that are suffering and that are really suffering, it opens you up to sympathy and to love for them. And I'm curious that that is definitely one route and one road it can open you up to it can also seen the suffering of people can also open you up to anger and hatred for the cause of that suffering. And so how are you able to take in that suffering and see the harm that they're being caused and respond with greater sympathy rather than the response of anger or hatred for what is causing that suffering to them?
Doh Say 34:08
Ye s. In when I was not strong spiritually I was many times many times afraid. Right away I want to pick up a gun and go shoot or even on the last last endeavor what happened in ranbu I just saw I was when people I know some people in Rangoon Mandalay or big city like oh no, I see this video go okay. I stay wanted to, but I just say remember, God what God wants me to do. Because if I just angry from here, then I destroy my surface. Because I cannot do franja to anything from that but just angry with them. So I do want to be angry because when I'm angry, I just limited my all my energy. My anger I destroyed my good heart. And I will destroy at least the other day I will not do my PT I will know pray tonight. So right away when I was angry I realized okay they say you I tell him I said you need to pray and I tell my son and my other friends to pray then I become okay because I know this is why we need to do go with where she was the way and those committee all these terrible things they were discharged by God dies how I can also maintain my anger. Otherwise every day I angry every day we go I see all these atrocity every day now even currently, you know many days last night one of my nieces nephew send me the address have the have us now, this many number mommies send more troops to Kearney seem like they would want to destroy the whole colony. Because about like, two weeks ago, or the jam paper, they were around like three cans, three virmani cans. So now they want to see sending more troops and two more petroni and blocking all the roles. So some other role even linking to from one city to city, the blouse or the people can travel easily, or the supply also can ascend easily. So these are also you know, when you are if you don't control yourself very well and then you become angry is stands I hold the holidays first. So, all of the same the IITs are there, here, the Ranger wherever here can you say I want to give you a present this my present you cannot see you cannot feel. But now we have used not only this life, but also currently internet life eternal life. And so the more you use, the more you have. Usually things you can touch you can see when on us. So there is a forever You do a small day when you drink our coffee. say God, thank you, I should I drink this coffee. So you say and he said thank you. So Danny God give you years to listen to. So he's telling you today what to do where to where to go. So there is your eyes. You look. So you see Sunday go to set up Sunday. No shake, knock, try to fix your high for me, you are learning things here you have to pay attention. So when you do wherever you do your study in the classroom or on site or your dream mission, you you are really to have intense interest in dementia. So try to use your brain when you need to. So I stay with them. This is my kind of my formula.
Host 38:00
Right? That's beautiful. And you It sounds like part of that is recognizing that anger is a tough, toxic emotion that hatred is something that takes you away from from faith and goodness and love and to try to not fall into that in spite of the hardships and the atrocities that you're facing. And you mentioned how this greater sense of faith and spiritual strength it came from your relationship with David Eubanks and what you've learned from him. You reference that when you grew up, it was in a trip more of a traditional conventional Christian upbringing. So I'm wondering if we could go back to your early years and if you can describe a bit about where you come from what your family like, what your family life was, like, what your life in the village was, and learn a little bit about your upbringing in your your your early years.
Doh Say 38:57
Yes. My parents were Christian, my aunt, uncle, cousin, religious dog, Christian. So I grew up so my I was born in a small, small town. So my parents will send me serious me when I was young send me a way to stay with my parents, all my aunts. So in order to want to give me the better education because my, my where I was born in tanta education, there was very, very low. So So my parents sent me away. So in order to give me a better education, since I grew up, so to make it short, so I, I was, I don't know maybe middle school students or one of the one of the, I don't know, Sunday school teachers, I went on she says to me, to pray for your enemy. And at that time, I don't understand why he was there. No, I cannot pray. He said How come there because I Can I even pray for myself? How can I pray for my enemy so the conversation just stopped there since then I went there was a DA had been his orders, school everything closed down in Ida da and there was so I came back to my hometown came down to my square where I stayed there for one half years. And then I took down Zane wine beginning of January Ay, ay, ay ay. Because I'm not so good in my opinion. So I thought maybe I look at the reason why. So I don't mind is the main is in here, I have launder money, then I can stay with my parents, maybe heavily heavily, because every time I'm not close to my parents, because since I was young, I stay away I stay with my anchors. So the every time I saw every time I come back to my village, I saw my parents now a shine to talk to them or when they come to visit me in the cities or another shy to talk to them. I was hiding them neither. So later I grew up I started thinking why I was doing my parents like that then I don't maybe money the main reason so if I have money, so maybe I saw this problem then I don't maybe I went to the in the Naga chain state that I change is very, very popular. So I thought I was going to throw in the mirror I left before I left my hometown I wrote a letter and I give to one of my close friends that gave him the letter to my parents. Only after I left the village the guy worried they received the letter first before I even had DMS told me so do not let me go away there so I left and then Baywatch was mortal we got stopped then they said oh we cannot keep going because of Amami clogging other roads and he was saying that another surgery is just not good a lot of fight happening is that we cannot go so we had to try on our on the passenger trials were to wait one day two days almost a week. We can very boring so we just ended and plays by the big river Sandy River. So one day one of my friends join me Okay, you want to go down, go down there is a boat going down there a place called cheetah. So Cheetah means changing agenzia small river come to that big river. And okay, so I said are waiting, I should go there. So I jumped into the bone, I came down. So since there my origin plan is and want to go to the chain stay in the know, to take j but I believe later I resumed My gosh, Tom, my compass to the north to go where the rivers flowing to the song. So I'm counting the song. So say that i i never managed to go to the J. J places by end Am I live here like this. And as Laurie, briefly before in the beginning, I jam with a trainee army. And later, I was a wounded. I have the major operation and they have to take two years to kill my boy in the clinic and hospital. And then later I recovered. So one of the leaders, you know, he's you know, go back to the army, but you should do more political work. So they sent me to the project, Foreign Affairs for the cleany National publicity party. I worked for 10 years. So to get my time with Kenny being in the army for 15 years. So yeah, so when I say that I said, You know, I did not know God. But when I was in the clinic, so every day I was lying on bed. So I was very, very, my injury was very big. So I almost cannot do any of these just you know, lying on bed, eat and sleep this off. But when I got a shortwave radio, so then I can open then a pastor and his name is Tim Armstrong. He said, I live in Beijing, Rangoon. So from Manila, he wrote questions about about God. So I started on a little bit about God trying to listen in, shall we really do. Great. So
Host 44:39
thanks for sharing that. So you you come from a grainy background. And you mentioned the schooling the political side that you you joined in terms of the cause and you reference also some of the the operations that you did. So a number of the listeners to our show. We have a number of foreigners who are outside of Myanmar, we also have a number of Burmese of Bomar that are both outside of the country as well as Omar that listen inside the country but many of those have never really spent time in the ethnic regions and haven't been in the villages or the regions where you've lived and where you've gone and we've been seeing in the past few months especially from these Bomar that many are coming to be more sympathetic and understanding and sensitive to what the ethnic experience has been for so long and are because they are faced with this now are starting to understand what people in your villages and communities have been dealing with for many generations. And so now you're speaking to that audience, both Bomar that are listening, as well as foreigners that are that are outside of Myanmar. And I wonder if you can share a bit about to that audience? If there's a way you can describe what is life like there? What What, what is the feeling? What is the what what is the community like living under that tear living under what the Burmese army The tamada is doing is capable of doing what they've done? The atrocities that that are happening that have happened? How can you for someone who's never been to these places and never experienced or felt? or seen what you have? How can you transmit and describe what your experience is for those who haven't been there so that they could better understand what what it's like to live in those communities and what it's been like for so many years?
Doh Say 46:45
Yes, living in places like that. So even though we're in the seat here in the jungles, so so I more know about the lives and in the mountain areas, because I've been to many places in many years. So whenever the brahmani comes even they can do a ride the villages, yes. So they already here in Burma, we head into their villages. So, all the villages villages already started preparing and leaving for finding packing and all their family. So so the two hideout areas, so some of the places that I was ever only very close to the villages, so they don't come they don't need to come they just from their candy sharing, sharing and so on nice shares, even our My hometown is say and only the big bonica every time they hear gunshots Bomani just found them all day they share 16 millimeters. So in our hometown we had to do many many many many halls since we were young I remember that one so I do know every houses have the hose because many bronies share the land in the villages. So one time one of my cousin hospital hit and one of the hospital he was a god destroy so then I went on my friend was living there right on that corner but then I for some reason he moved to another house so in the night time there was fighting broke down so like to hear gunshots so whenever they hear gunshots is they don't know they don't say is grainy So do we have as a digits from because our main cams on the haitong so this is in the body on the mounting so from the top there's just so many mortars to the into the village so Sunday like the many PVR the god k extended counties when I was young I stayed a member of families just k beside their house the buying the shares so the now there are many people in housing city now they're now they're suffering because they start doing many, many atrocities as you see. So they come here and then maybe they know the way they live, they come to the DC area or these like train stations they have the chance day so very different on you know when when it is they live. So and then every time even on the visit they arrive says no savior because they can't cams everywhere. So and then we say okay, now you got to be careful tonight and maybe Romani can hear they can, they can also send some door shares. So then they have to move. So they start realizing Oh, now we are also had to move. So maybe all these admin people have to do like they for many, many years for more than 70 years. So we just arrived here so we had to do some of the Starting convenient oh we cannot do or difficulty rainy or mosquito no enough fruit. And then this idea I don't know of Yeah, sure they they really can understand the different new PVS every under the successive military regime from India years. And so for me every time when the, the see here last time we were, we were in southern current state. So whether we see many CDN members, they are many, most of them very young like between 20 and 30. So, and they are really, really no country to, in order to do something in order to over, over kind of topple the dictatorship. And I when I look at them, I can know some of them, they are very innocent. And before I don't know, if I met them like 20 years ago, I may not have the feeling because that I still have the hatred against or the damage, but all I know is that the domains are very, very bad, they are doing all the bad things to the all the different ethnic groups here and when I became to know Jesus better, so Jesus does He say you should love this one and I hate that one. Oh, he say that love your neighbor, then ours are the same towels, I remember one versus as a Avi Don't forget that I will not forgive you. Then since then, as I started losing all the people I tied up in my cars, including Berman's are Chinese and say sonisphere has a say as you know, and the against the Chinese because now they are doing many bad things in our country. And so yeah, India. So now I say release releasing all of this. So then I will look at the most of them of Burma, we saw and I went through one of one of our almost 200 and we went down there we're getting up all night, three days training, how to do how to buy basic tourney layer first aid trainees. So those are only one on one support. These are the many support. So most of them dummies. And so we shared and we don't share this at all now so we understand the admin suffering for many years. So
Host 52:35
that's very powerful. What you just said and this is something that we're hearing much more of is that many Bomar especially the younger generation are for the first time understanding the privilege that they had in the system, the the ways that the ethnics were were discriminated against and biased in ways that that they were not and in ways that they they did not have to face these things. And many of them are have been apologizing publicly and privately for not doing more and not understanding and not recognizing the kind of suffering that their Burmese army was inflicting on these ethnic regions. And you mentioned that, you know, 20 years ago before you found religion, that the hatred that you had for the Burmese army was absorbed into all of the Bomar people that it was just the hatred that you had for the whole race based on how the army was behaving and through religion, you were able to work slowly at letting go of the toxicity of that of that hatred and move towards towards love as far as possible. But what I'm wondering now is that you've actually been training young damar activists, and as you mentioned, some of those have said to you that they're sorry that they didn't realize the suffering that their army was inflicting on you and so you're you're getting this apology you're getting this recognition, something that I imagine you You must have never heard in your life. So how has it felt for you to hear from these young Burmese these these apologies and this recognition of what you've been going through and what your people have been going through for so many years.
Doh Say 54:23
I I just you know I become fallen in love with them because even this morning, when all my friends who video camera man, show me the video via video footage as he took and I look at their all their faces very sad that they are very lovely. Because a you know they lay everything they are from Rangoon, they can they can just stay in their home nor do they don't need to worry when they come here. The first thing they are everyday is a very, you know, in a fluid situation, you know live inside you Wishing everything very, very, very, very well this day, happy singing songs and you know, enjoying the, the scale we are given. so damn Oh my I don't have any any lines or any boundaries. So all I know is I just I just like them all and when I sometimes I was saying my friends I realized I missed them and is and the power or the the expression, the sincere expression. And also we can't know better. So when we leave we go we on a short time. So one group like three days one group maybe like three weeks. So and now he another group. So but most of the groups are here currently. But the first group, the big group we met and found as many Berman's we have big group. And another big question about 200 and as a mixture of the Berman's and Christian law who belong Canadian cranny so yeah, there's more than that.
Host 56:10
So there's like this real sense of unity before that hasn't been experienced prior.
Doh Say 56:15
Yeah, no. Look at all these are very beautiful. These are all we need. We only need like that in order to in our new country every everyday everyone thing like the everyone, again, like the ID, our country where the very beautiful.
Host 56:33
Right? Right. So on this podcast platform, we've spoken to a number of Bomar activists and we've talked about how they felt when the coup hit on February 1, and what they've been doing since what what their reaction and their feeling has been for something that for many of them was was so new, it was really something they never faced before. And going through that you on the other hand and your community, you've been doing this kind of work and having you you've been facing off with this enemy committing these atrocities and not allowing your people in your community to rest for you know, 60 years not not able to be safe in their own homes. We're hearing from so many Burmese now that they're not safe in their own homes. And it's the first time they've ever felt that and there's there's this terror and this instability from knowing that you're never safe. And yet, you and your community, you have faced that lack of safety for pretty much all your lives. So I'm curious what your feelings were when the coup broke on February 1, when, when the coup started. And in the months afterwards, what what was your analysis of what was happening? How were your feelings? How did you respond? How were you following it? What what reaction Did you have as the coup broke and then developed
Doh Say 57:54
when we were in one of the IDB headhouse within the IDPs, when they took it took power from the government. So that I don't think much bigger, I know the nature of the military regime, they have been doing for many years. So even before they're studying 5g in any way, they're doing it the same, they're only using different techniques. But I don't think there will be a big big demonstration we have been like that. Because now that time maybe that people know so maybe they are blackout so they don't know about outside outside the wall because at that time they call Burma socialist program party, they do blogger, everyone they are even you try you're very smart, you're trying to do something a little bit vague as the right way to go and a blog. So you cannot you cannot do like bigger bigger size dummies you cannot develop a whatever you are doing. Today, so many people are the data, okay, these are maybe our testing me this all we need to satisfy with this, this and this and things are changing a lot. So that time also is when they turn the power. So I don't I I did think that there would be a big big group, like period where do our rising like that. But I know I think that because people are suffering and this a young generation, the they have become more educated and they also they're more or the access to the international community. So I have internet internet access and more relevant before. So and they learn more things. And also there's been many years even before some of them were not born yet when the trauma surgery program 30 while running the country, but they hear from their parents and unsure and so that now seven instead of seven in an hour they themselves Stephanie so that is why study or the Young PVS exclosures also one more thing for sure is that either DNS cannot cannot go long. Today or tomorrow there will happen. So because the same day the true also can never be hidden. You go anti 10. In here Ranger was during the week, we teach them. So we do the kind of small text, small test. So it's okay during the test, you have only one meal to eat no other things. So why did they come here? So I was in SMS pause, so they had to kind of do the same. So the same so when they say because many of them are afraid of water. So when they are afraid, oh, they don't think or anything. And they say, No, we kind of pressure to jam into the water, the water and then suddenly, many things flow floating in the water in life, you know, the snags are these floating. So and then I didn't even realize the guy really forgets not to draw in the water. They don't even see all these things floating in the water. Then I thought you see you never hide the truth. So the same day? Well, I mean, they've been doing bad things for many years, and then go and allow them to do. And I believe they're touching other people. And so to stand up against this immunity, the SEC says 72 regions.
Host 1:01:36
So what do you think it will take to win?
Doh Say 1:01:39
Yeah, so the pizza will win because the pizza the first day, I don't know. And they're believing God, for sure. God also righteousness. So God will stand with them against me to do
Host 1:01:56
great. So in terms of your faith and your your spiritual belief, it's this power of prayer and your belief in God and from a diverse people of different kinds of faiths and practices people our other guests we've talked, we've spoken to have, have shared how their own religious faith has, has been a resource for them to draw upon looking at practically speaking, and, and with the training, you're doing the Alliance's, you're making the strategy. What What do you think it's going to take practically for the people to win at this point.
Doh Say 1:02:32
trainees, because we said that you first you have to follow God. And you have to love because every everyone, even bad guys, they also maybe small tiny baby has to have the good thing I think inside their heart. So the where we show them that they, they some of them will become chained to good. So some of them, we also stay stubborn and you know a chain that is in the Andes up to up to the Enter between them and God. So when I was saying we first were to show them, the cigar loves and also our mercy. And then when they don't listen their way we have to do we had to do. So first I told them we were first when you do enemies. So you show them love. Okay, please don't stop doing that like that. You tell them one time, two time three times they only say then you pray and then feel assured and assure you, you fight and you fight. So these are we believe because these power or love. So every while we try to teach them a cipher on this scale, but the most important things that you have the love that you love comes from God. And with God, we can't win this fight easily. So but we still need to work on law and planning, planning very well and apply this law and go and do.
Host 1:04:07
So you mentioned how when you found religious faith, you were able to let go of the hatred you had for just the Bomar people for the pain that was inflicted upon you. But there's definitely a difference between the Braemar people and the Bomar military and the actual soldiers, the Burmese people, the Burmese military that are physically causing harm to your communities. So I'm going to ask you a hard question. How has it been to try to develop love for actual members of the Burmese military for actual individuals who are causing harm to those very communities that you're in touch with?
Doh Say 1:04:54
Yeah, there are several ways you can do a you can also do many many ways. So to one of the ways so, someday, we will see the Burmese defectors. So, come to the here different admin groups. So, you can there one way, other way also you can show them on through the internet, you can say that okay we forgive you, you stop doing all this this. So, too many people will go back so, they can they can tell their friends for friends, because maybe one or the relatives or sons or daughters. So, because we are assuming So, then we, our heart cannot be hard, our heart cannot be held for a long time. someday maybe we will highs very, very hard line wrong. One day when especially when, where we very Whig the moment our highs becomes you know, thought, see one day you are very, very strong, but today you are sick. So you cannot do that they usually do today, you Your face is very different from yesterday. So the Burma army the same day, now they are facing many casualty inside. And they are wise, as wise they are some dododo crying a lot because the father's son, they know the brothers are being killed in the many different admin areas. So so the same data that we need to also send a message to those, okay, just say your husband or your your sons or your brothers to start doing this thing that you will be forgiving, but difficult because we're talking about forgiveness here so difficult because especially those who swear their relatives or sister brothers or medical care, these are one of the way to have a long lasting solution for our country.
Host 1:07:04
So do you actually have communication or a relationship with your enemy? Do you actually engage in discussions with members of the tamada
Doh Say 1:07:14
not directly, like through the you know, the messenger or you can write like that? Mainly not through the messenger, because there are so many of members. So they are the absolute beginner groups. They also do many wrong information. So you can also tell them, even when they do bad things, you don't do bad things, but you can also send to them. So if you send me an email you maybe more than one of them can can listen.
Host 1:07:45
And have you had Have you had that experience before? Have you had the experience of talking to an active duty Burmese soldier and trying to convince him to not engage in battle about the power of love about the power of unity and forgiveness? And have you been able to have success with those kinds of conversations with even a single soldier?
Doh Say 1:08:07
No, no, not only before the like detractors are detractors, but know that I was not talking about detail like that. So guys, 10 out, okay, now, we are all together. You come here you join with us. We are happy. I said don't go back. Don't go back to the army again. So you can stay here or you can or you can go wherever you want. But don't go back to there. And
Host 1:08:37
so have detectors come to your camp?
Doh Say 1:08:39
Yeah. Wow. One guy kind of is that maybe I didn't know 10 years ago. So NATO, I think his name was Yeah, he was he said he wasn't around me and they do many bad things. So I don't know how he escaped from the army. And then later he was saying to here because he Wang he came to recall k three area k three and K three leaders. So send me into your Ranger training camp. So he got baptized here. So he like we told them okay, these are the problems Yeah. Now he realized he were doing very bad things. Then we told him about Jesus. And he said, Okay, don't go back. can go back to the army. If you don't want to stay here, you can go out of cases. We're not back to the army. analyze some of the long time now reason is a long time ago, so this guy also maybe like 10 years ago, and some other guys. So a long time ago, 15 years ago. So when we just use the opportunity or the Challenge Level Is this a bra is a very bad, you know? Now you don't, we don't need to tell you you're it Kenyans they guide us explain even how they were treated by their own is a cost and they say okay their salary was at that time maybe 10,000. So they never received fully. So every every money they received last year, maybe how are their salary? They are they were toys, okay, you need to you need to pay for this feeder feeder fee many fees. So and with that the only receive How would they sell salary. So it is one of the few things as more dangerous, either Monday or the army officer abuse them. So later now, they cannot say all these decided to run away from the army in a combat come to Korean or Korean Yahshua. And
Host 1:10:52
see, right, so you reference that recently, you've started to make contact with many young Burmese who have fled their life in the cities and come to some of your camps for training. And I'm wondering, what are you teaching them in, in these courses? And how are they doing because you mentioned they're very innocent, you know, that's one word for definitely, they're, they're also these are people that were probably living in the city that had not really faced any kind of real danger or combat probably for most of their lives, that this whole experience is completely new for them. And suddenly, they're in this training course with you very far from their home and a different culture, sometimes with having to put up with difficult conditions and learn entirely new skills on what I imagine is a pretty rigorous course and have to use those skills to then go back and face a ferocious enemy. And these people are coming from a background of city life and of, you know, school or job or family or whatever they have. So what has been your experience in what you've been teaching them and how they've been responding to these trainings?
Doh Say 1:12:08
Yes, I want to say I'm on to when I started meeting then in March, so I actually advertise at the training finish. I became now I went to teach them more and more. So guys, with records CDM groups. So the before the Ranger freedom Ranger training is different. So this group only the three weeks, so because we we don't have the time, we also cannot divide our stuff for many places, too many days, we went and we taught only three days. And then we saved to maintain our main training site. And then once by the light three weeks, so in three weeks, we teach them mainly about God and how to learn and how to forgive, to the maintenance. And then every morning every evening, we have PT because I know they need to be strong to try to do all these difficult jobs. Then we teach them how to use the phone safely. Staveley become you know, things are now very different compared to their life 15 years ago, everywhere we were using phone so it again says they can set up their network so among their friends so and so we taught them how to use their phone, smartphone safely and their first aid for basics first a line reading if someone wanted me reading how to start a reading using the tiny gear and how to transfer the wound patients from the barrier Fie to the same place and how to do them. So there are many ways are carrying the patients and stop the bleeding and their leadership. He just escaped and swimming and repenting and two hands a self defense so even though where are they are they want to come here Give me weapons, gimme gimme guns. Sorry, we are sorry, we don't have we give you all we have. So we gave the audience and they can use all these is a no without without guns. They can say Jews and the most important things that we do every day you do pray first. And then thing and then the egg. So in the USA, so don't be don't don't get caught. They are lovely in my face. They are insert their faces phases. So we don't want to see the end being being arrested or, you know, torture or key or put in prison. So there's so many periods and get a kick out describe because last two months, I met with about altogether maybe over over over 400 400 different groups. In that one spot. I almost went another sport that 200 so and there was boys like 50 people. And now here we have 51 so right here mom this time here more Korean people. Yes they are Superman's from Tron series.
Host 1:15:28
All right. So it's my understanding that you're going to be taking off on a mission soon. And before you go. We're so lucky to have Dave Eubank sitting by you and having heard this interview, and it's just been so lovely to hear all that you've been sharing. And regarding the question that I asked about some of the defectors that have been coming in from the Burmese army into your camps, he indicated that he had some stories that he wanted to share with us. So Dave, thanks so much for joining us here at the end of the interview. And please go ahead with some of the these these anecdotes you're gonna tell.
1:16:04
A Thank you so much. And thank you, dear listeners, this debut bank of the freedom Rangers, and you've been listening to dough say, it means big silver. And he raised my kids, our kids, our three kids in their very small, has risked his life numerous times to protect them, and every kind of situation, active war all the way down to being drugged by horses, whatever it took, he broke his hand and his fingers trying to disengage my son's leg as he's being drugged as a four year old under a horse on a middle of a mission, a amazing guy, and helps my wife on the kids programs. So you were asking him about Burmese soldiers. And we don't have that many, but we've treated a few Burmese soldiers in the frontline once they were wounded and captured. And I remembered once on a mission in pawn district, where to DK ba that was the democratic Korean Buddhist army. These are proxies of the Burma army. were setting up trying to spy on us as we moved in a column and we caught them. And they were terrified to be executed by the Canada. Like I said, Don't be afraid, come with us. And you'll see what we do. And we brought that along. And we said, you know, if you try to escape, you're gonna be dead. You don't try to escape, we'll treat you fine. Because if you escape, you're gonna tell them who we are, and we're gonna get slaughtered. So they went along with us. And I asked the candidates that on time, I think they're going to run, I'll take responsibility, and they walk with me for three days. And at the first day, they got to watch a kids program. And then we did dentistry in the jungle. And they said, We have neither fillings. Can you do that? And one of my team members is the dentist. And he drilled and filled, they're in the jungle and they smile. They said, Can we stay with you? So for the next three days, they stayed with us. And then we released them once we turned away from that area started climbing over the next mountain range. And I thought, what are they going to tell the Burma army that they're helping people? I'm not worried. Well, the army came after us, because they probably told us where we're at. But I knew they didn't hate us. And we got away easily. And I remember in this camp, does say talked about Sunday to who was a Burmese soldier who admitted to atrocities killing a pregnant woman once he said, and he said, I did not tell anyone here that finally though, listening to words about God's love and His forgiveness. I just couldn't hold it in my heart. And I confessed it and the people here didn't kill me. Now I want to be a follower of Jesus, because I feel his love and forgiveness. So we baptize them right here. And you should see a smile on this guy's face, different person. And before that are actually not almost the same time. But back in Thailand. This was in Burma, those two stories, but back in Thailand, once I was with a Can you pray National Union? And we're having a meeting, I didn't know they were in the middle of another secret meeting.
1:16:04
And we were at a place on the border that I accidentally gone to, because I'm close to the KHU and I know the place? I didn't plan to go that day. And right when I was there, I see this delegation walking in
David Eubank 1:16:43
there Burmese soldiers moments, I was like, Wow, it was a secret meeting i'd stumbled into like Mr. Bean. And there was General Aung Min. I looked at him. He looked at me, I was wearing my Free Burma Rangers t shirt. He goes, David, Eubank, he said in English, I said, General Aung Min. And I said, you know, we'd met each other 24 hours ago in the jungle, maybe we're both be dead. But look, we've met and God has given us a new chance. And my kids are with me. Yes. Oh, I've heard of your children who grew up in the jungle. And he said, I want to meet your wife, who who educated them as she was right there. And we had he said, Maybe one day you can come to Rangoon. And I said we'd love that. And he said, Would you dare to train Burmese soldier teams? I said, Yeah, we'll train anybody to help people and get the news out for love. But if you attack the ethnics or anyone will stand with the people that are under attack. So I have to consider that too. And but we're not on the ethnic side against the Burman side, we're on the side of love and truth. And I love what Alexander Solzhenitsyn said. He said, the line of good and evil is not between peoples nations, tribes races, is in the middle of every human heart. And also, he went on to say something I believe is true. In the most vile evil persons a shred of love, a shred of hope. They love maybe their mom, their dog, something, there's always a shred of hope, and possibility. In the most wonderful person, there's a shred of evil, and certainly potential evil. So none of us are perfect. We're all together. And we have to choose, in my opinion, to be part of God's kingdom of love and light are part of Satan's kingdom of evil. He got the two choices, good or evil. When you choose good, doesn't mean you're always good. I remember one Karen leader told me a journalist was asking him, what about the Free Burma Rangers? What do you think of them? And the crime leader said when they follow God, they're good when they don't, they're bad. And I would say that's true of me. So back to general Aung Min. So we're talking about this back and forth. And I said, gentlemen, can we pray? He said, Sure. And he's a Buddhist, I'm a Christian. And I held his hand on and I began to pray. And I felt this warmth, from his hand to mine. And I said, Lord, Jesus, thank you for this opportunity to be friends and be new friends, please show us a new way in Jesus name. And he smile, and I smile that we hug each other. I took a photo with him and my family and, and he's a friend to this day, I still communicate with him. Now he's been retired or forced to retire, and I share the right words for it. So he's not in this regime right now. But I love him. And so those are only a couple of the opportunities we had meet our enemies. And I remember once when this is back in American history, when it Abraham Lincoln wanted to buy, invite a political adversary over and his staff said, Sir, that's an enemy, you're inviting for dinner? And he said, Well, wouldn't you want that enemy to become a friend. And so something else in the context of situation here to talk about the end up the national unity government, and the ethnic armed groups, and the CRP, H, and all these different groups. And usually you can find something that you don't like about one of them, and disagreed back and forth. But I love what Winston Churchill said, the only thing worse than allies or enemies. So we all opportunities to be allies with everyone and find what we can agree on and with our enemies, to pray for them to find every chance we can to extend love and forgiveness. as Joe said, Sometimes you're gonna have to fight because people won't listen, ISIS wouldn't listen, many groups, May, Burma, soldiers won't listen. But you go into it with an open heart saying, Please listen. And also always remembering a bullet can stop a human heart is sometimes will need to, but it never changes to human heart. The only thing that changes our heart for good is love. So that's what I pray for. So thank you for this opportunity to share. And back to Joe say, and I'm sorry, we got to get rid of walkout. Just actually very short little mission, we're going on a coordination mission to be back in a couple days.
Host 1:23:11
So don't say thank you so much for joining us and your perspective. And your experience here has just been so valuable to share to our listener base, we, this interview will be listened to, as I mentioned before by many Bomar in the country, as well as many foreigners around the world. And so, before we close, I just want to ask you if there's anything else you want to use this platform for if there's any other message that you want to get out about your opinion, your perspective, your background to be able to share to our audience base.
Doh Say 1:23:45
Yes. I want to say based on my belief, and also seeing from many, many, many people really, so the first time to have gone because now our country around the world doesn't make any progress. Because first because many of you guys do not have gone When do you not have gone You don't have to because in our country, in many leader they prioritize God and that they have love and the country where we can very beautiful the same day not only Burma, many, many countries around the world. So these are very important. We have this, God love and forgive each other. And then we have you all set.
Host 1:24:37
That's beautiful. Thank you for sharing and I know we're wrapping up this this interview you're just literally minutes away from stepping back into the jungle for a mission of a few days and we're just we're talking right until the very end of when your mission is starting. Can you can you tell us anything about what you're doing not to expose any any kind of risk or or share anything Shouldn't be shared. But in any general terms can can you share what you're going to be doing the next few days?
Doh Say 1:25:07
object yeah days trainee who had to do all these trainings to the frontline like to do their predicate Joe mission.
Host 1:25:21
I see. Well, thank you. Well, I understand you have to get going now. So thank you so much for your time. And please be safe.
Doh Say 1:25:27
Thank you, thank you very much for the interview. And God bless you for sharing time from the places, he brought very, two big pieces of the 100 millimeter and 120 million millimeter shares. So this is under shader because in the area, there's a cancer around that area. So every time they hear something they they share. So even before at least shooting with the rifles, now, the first I heard you share with a big, big share, Wanda 120 millimeters. So we're bringing all these students to that area. And then they will do the program for the case and as soon as they are the parents and villages around there. So after that, one week, maybe two programs there, then after that he can't go back to the origin, especially area that will take a walk in maybe two more days from diarrhea.
Host 1:26:38
Thank you for taking the time to listen to this show. I understand that this is an enormously difficult time for many people these days, myself included. And just the mere fact of staying informed is helping to keep a focus on this pertinent issue. And the only way that we can do our job of continuing to provide this content at this very critical time is through the support of generous donors, listeners like yourselves. So if you found this episode of value and would like to see more shows like this on the current crisis, please consider making a donation to support our efforts. Either monthly pledges or one time donations are fully appreciated. And all funds go immediately into the production of more episodes like this one. Thank you deeply in advance and best wishes at this time. 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Finally, we're open to suggestions about guests or topics for future episodes. So if you have someone or something in mind, please do be in touch. We would like to take this time to thank everyone who made this podcast possible. Currently, our team consists of two sound engineers, Mike pink and Martin combs. There's of course Zack Kessler, content collaborator and part time co host, Ken pranskey helps with editing and a special Mongolian volunteer who is asked to remain anonymous does our social media templates. In light of the ongoing crisis in Myanmar, a number of volunteers have stepped in to lend a hand as well. And so we'd like to take this time to appreciate their effort and our time of need. And we're always on the lookout for more volunteers during this critical time. So if you'd like to contribute, definitely let us know. We'd also like to thank everyone who has assisted us in arranging for the guests we've interviewed so far. And of course, we send a big thank you to the guests themselves, for agreeing to come on and share such personal powerful stories. Finally, we're immensely grateful for the donors who made this entire thing possible. We want to remind our listeners that the opinions expressed by our guests are their own and don't necessarily reflect the host or other podcast contributors. Please also note that we are mainly a volunteer team, we do not have the capacity to fact check our guest interviews. By virtue of being invited on our show. There's a trust that they will be truthful and not misrepresent themselves or others. If you have any concerns about the statements made on this or other shows, please contact us this recording is the exclusive right of Insight Myanmar podcast and may not be used without the expressed written permission of the podcast owner, which includes video, audio, written transcripts or excerpts of any episodes. Also not meant to be used for commercial purposes. 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1:35:05
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